Avi Melamed: Recording in progress.
Avi Melamed: Very tough, very important presidential rally and giving you
Avi Melamed: that was very well.
Avi Melamed: bad.
Avi Melamed: That's okay.
Avi Melamed: And President Trump doesn't agree with people. Speak. Ohio, add it back in back.
Avi Melamed: Yeah, Warren, that's it. Are you
Avi Melamed: appreciate that question?
Avi Melamed: There you go.
Avi Melamed: No, ma'am, and
Avi Melamed: well, here it is, founder on the counter.
Maia Hoffman: I thought you were gonna log in from our account.
Maia Hoffman: I thought you were just gonna log in from our account.
Maia Hoffman: But hold on you. You're muted. You're muted.
didier bodin: Alright! Can you hear me now?
Avi Melamed: Yeah.
didier bodin: Yeah, I don't have this reflex. Actually.
didier bodin: that's not the link that we put on the portal.
Maia Hoffman: I started the I started the but hold on.
didier bodin: That's not the link that we are that you gave me to put on the portal. So when, to be sure that people have the correct link to join today.
Maia Hoffman: Well, just to be sure, why don't you? I hope it's the right one that because I emailed out.
Maia Hoffman: Wait, hold on what I emailed. What I, what I sent out was.
didier bodin: Too many emails. Which one was that.
Maia Hoffman: Oh, 1, 3, 5.
didier bodin: Is the 1, 3, 5.
Maia Hoffman: This is what I this is what I sent out.
didier bodin: What's the the topic of the.
Maia Hoffman: Here. No, I'm just sending you the link. That's what I that's the link that I put it in the chat.
didier bodin: Okay, yeah. But in which email, did you send that link?
Maia Hoffman: Well, it doesn't matter, but that's the one I'm using. So maybe it's maybe it's hold on a second.
Maia Hoffman: You know what. Let me. Let me
Maia Hoffman: make sure I'm on the right one. No, it's it, says itme fellowship historical.
Maia Hoffman: Yeah.
didier bodin: So it's just on. On which email did you send it out.
Maia Hoffman: I put it.
Maia Hoffman: I don't remember what, but that's the one I've been using.
didier bodin: Okay, cause that's you. You gave me 2 links already to put.
Maia Hoffman: No one's using the portal to log in.
didier bodin: I know. I know, I know, because that's my just was just the link I went to use. So
didier bodin: we just need to be sure that people got the claims.
Maia Hoffman: Well, I sent this link by it's 0 1, 3, 5. I sent it by email and by Whatsapp to everyone.
didier bodin: Okay, just like on 6.
Maia Hoffman: And that's the one I think I used on the calendar link.
Maia Hoffman: Yeah. Oh, 1, 3, 5.
didier bodin: Let let me see what I have on my calendar link, because
Maia Hoffman: Oh, 1 0, 3, 1 5, I mean
didier bodin: Calendar.
Maia Hoffman: This does it appear on my Google Calendar with that does not appear on the windows.
didier bodin: 0 1, 3, 5. This was in the calendar.
Maia Hoffman: Yeah.
didier bodin: Okay. Great.
Maia Hoffman: That's not what I sent you right now. Maybe.
didier bodin: It's.
Maia Hoffman: Different.
didier bodin: 0 1, 3, 5, yes, a 2. Yeah, yeah. I guess that's a new link that after I created all the rooms.
Maia Hoffman: What?
didier bodin: After virag updated the links.
Maia Hoffman: I don't understand what that means.
didier bodin: Maybe she maybe the link change after she created.
Maia Hoffman: Did you do.
didier bodin: No, okay, and that's gonna be the link for every session, or just this one.
Maia Hoffman: Every session, but I hope that we're in the right one.
didier bodin: Right now what you'll give. Yes, I clicked on the 0 1, 3, 5, and that's what I
Maia Hoffman: You just said what I sent you wasn't what was the on the port.
didier bodin: No what you just sent me through Whatsapp was good
didier bodin: just before that. I I what I have on the portal was not so I guess it's old.
Maia Hoffman: That might have been the old one. We I had another one, but then we changed it.
Maia Hoffman: But yeah, this is the one that yeah, this is the one I started.
didier bodin: As we're good.
Maia Hoffman: Now I'm like nervous, though. What's where do I see the
Maia Hoffman: where do I? Can I see the number where we are? Oh, here's copy, invite link.
didier bodin: The link you just the link you just sent me is the link I use to join.
didier bodin: So we're good.
Maia Hoffman: Okay.
didier bodin: Yeah, cause you, you know.
Maia Hoffman: I mean, I have to go get. Obviously I have to go get him up. Hold on a second.
didier bodin: Okay, I just want to reopen what's the layout of the of the event.
didier bodin: I don't know.
didier bodin: hi eighties
Maia Hoffman: I just got a note from Aaliyah. If we're
Maia Hoffman: Aaliyah just sent me a message asking if we're if we're oh, Beth is here. Okay. Now that I know it's right because people are starting to log on. So
Maia Hoffman: hey.
beth goldsmith: How are you?
Maia Hoffman: Good! How are you?
beth goldsmith: I'm fine hanging in hanging in. How about? I mean, I think I was trying to figure out when Avi was doing the the last post I saw like it was like in the dark in a moving vehicle like, were you driving? Was he? Well.
Maia Hoffman: The very last one.
beth goldsmith: Also.
Maia Hoffman: Actually it was actually the very last one we did was in the driveway here. We literally left Tulsa at 2 Am.
beth goldsmith: Yeah, it was like 3 am. And he's in the dark in a.
Maia Hoffman: Yeah. Oh, yeah, yeah. Yeah. When we were driving. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm like.
beth goldsmith: Right. So I said so you might. You must have been driving.
Maia Hoffman: Yes, I was drive. I drove from 2 to 7,
Maia Hoffman: and then he drove from 7 to 4, and then I drove from 4 to 9.
Maia Hoffman: Yeah, we got here about 9.
beth goldsmith: I gotta say I mean, seriously, this tour, maybe more than anything else, is a test of your relationship. It's a lot of time to be in that proximity.
Maia Hoffman: Definitely.
Maia Hoffman: Definitely. Yeah, it's but you know, I didn't think we could do a drive that long. I I mean, we never attempted something that long. But like we're here. But we have to today, actually, or maybe early tomorrow. But but but I'm gonna I'm just gonna let I can let people in right like you're fine, right?
beth goldsmith: Yes, of course.
Maia Hoffman: Okay. So
Maia Hoffman: so Avi is actually addressing the Pennsylvania Legislature tomorrow morning in Westburg. So we so we have to hey, like. So we have to either leave tonight, or maybe early, so I know we had like no time. So I figured, you know what. Let's just get back, at least for a little bit of Friday night dinner. So we actually, yeah, it was
Maia Hoffman: it was a yeah, but it wasn't as difficult as we thought. Hi aiden.
beth goldsmith: No, you I was. Gonna say, I think you look amazing. You don't have like a bag under your I mean, you look like you're well rested. You're smiling, you have rosy cheeks, you know.
Maia Hoffman: I guess maybe it's maybe it's knowing that.
beth goldsmith: Those girls keep coming back home. The hostages.
Maia Hoffman: You know.
beth goldsmith: At least there's some something positive going on in the world.
Maia Hoffman: Yes. Okay, yeah. Hold on. I just want to tell Avi something. So either I can say this, or you can say that I can't read my handwriting right? All I wanted. You're hearing like the like. Prep. Here, guys, we're all found. Hi Aiden. It's good to meet you.
Aden Kosoi: Good to meet you as well.
Maia Hoffman: It's aiden right?
Aden Kosoi: Yup!
Maia Hoffman: Okay, just want to be sure.
Maia Hoffman: So wait. I'm just gonna mute myself for one second.
Aliya Zigman: Didier, were you able to
Aliya Zigman: get the papers all like the sheet, all fine with the editing and stuff.
didier bodin: Excuse me.
Aliya Zigman: Like. You know how I I sent you a long.
Aliya Zigman: long thing. Were you able to get it? So you were able to edit it. I think that was you. Who asked, or was it Vera?
didier bodin: Maybe it was via. But I saw that you sent an email with a with a detailed document.
didier bodin: Oh, okay, okay, we received it. Yeah, it's been reviewed already. Thank you. Thank you so much.
Aliya Zigman: Okay, that's it.
Maia Hoffman: I know, and then but you should just be. Are you muted? You're muted. We need, to be sure, mute. Your we're sitting next to each other. So we need to be sure that our laptops are
Maia Hoffman: knew that. Okay, now you're.
didier bodin: Came back.
Maia Hoffman: Avi mulamed is currently host. Reclaim.
Maia Hoffman: stay co-host.
Maia Hoffman: Okay?
Maia Hoffman: What happened to Aaliyah?
Maia Hoffman: There? She you're on mute. You're on mute.
Aliya Zigman: I'm really sick. So if I turn my computer off, I'm like coughing and stuff. So I'm still here. I just.
Maia Hoffman: That's okay. Alright. Okay. Alright. Well, thank you for was, thank you for making the commute.
Maia Hoffman: So yeah. So that that was our. That was our journey.
Maia Hoffman: So now we could drive. Now we could drive to Boca in one shot. Easy, you know.
Maia Hoffman: There we go.
beth goldsmith: Finally coming out of we're coming out of our version of the Arctic air
beth goldsmith: like today. It's in the sixties. But it was as low as 43 yesterday, I mean, we had all our windows sort of had condensation on them, you know, from it being so cold on the other side of of things.
Maia Hoffman: Well, we we were when we left for those of you that are coming in. We drove Avi and I drove from Tulsa to Baltimore in one shot
Maia Hoffman: on. So it was 18 h, and so we were. We were driving either through. And this is Beth Goldsmith, our board member for those of you who have one of our board members who has not met her.
Maia Hoffman: so anyway. We we were either like in. I don't know if we were in Oklahoma or Missouri. It was 4 degrees, and I kept sticking my hand out the window to see what 4 degrees felt like.
beth goldsmith: And and I bet your response was, oh, not good.
Maia Hoffman: No, actually, it wasn't so bad. I was like, Oh, you put your head out the window. He's like, no, I'm like, I kind of wanted to stop just to get out of the car. But I did. But I gotta make time. I'm like my father. My father was all about like making time. You gotta make time. So I didn't want to stop to like feel the.
beth goldsmith: Right. You can't, and you can't like waste the stop. It has to.
Maia Hoffman: Yes, Tom.
beth goldsmith: That has several purposes.
Maia Hoffman: No, no, no! We stopped 3 times, just for gas, that's it, that is all
Maia Hoffman: that is, I'm trying to admit.
beth goldsmith: And Carl's here.
Maia Hoffman: You're oh.
beth goldsmith: Carl, you are looking really awfully wonderful for a zoom call.
Maia Hoffman: Carl. Look how Carl's dressed, and look how you're dressed.
CARL CHIAPPA: Okay, thank you, Beth. I haven't been told that I look wonderful in about 30 years.
beth goldsmith: And I've got.
CARL CHIAPPA: Sure about that.
beth goldsmith: We should talk more often, Carl. I always have lovely things to say.
Maia Hoffman: I put on mascara.
CARL CHIAPPA: To have a weekly call. Now.
Ronnie Footlick: Your hair, Maya. You're looking great.
Maia Hoffman: Thank you.
Maia Hoffman: I was gonna in my hair set. I was gonna actually wash it. But then my hair would be flat for this, and I'd be sitting there. So I decided that
beth goldsmith: I like your hair the bigger the better, but.
Maia Hoffman: I know. So do I.
Maia Hoffman: That's just me watch it when I do anything but this.
Maia Hoffman: When I 1st wash it, it's flat.
Maia Hoffman: Okay? So everybody who has joined is here. Oh, everyone is 1255. Thank you.
Ronnie Footlick: You held a gun to our head.
beth goldsmith: Yeah.
Maia Hoffman: Wait, Samantha.
Maia Hoffman: No, avi, I did it deliberately. I think it's fine that way. I I took everything off the table.
Maia Hoffman: It's fine. The the frame is good, it's fine.
Maia Hoffman: I took all the clutter off. We're literally sitting next to each other like, I'm like, we're at the same table. So, okay.
Maia Hoffman: wow, thank you. Everyone for being I.
Maia Hoffman: I just I don't. Okay, I don't.
Maia Hoffman: Oh, can you do that? Okay, wait. I'm just gonna wait one second
Maia Hoffman: one just small housekeeping thing for later virag. I'm still co-host, so do you still have access.
Virag Gulyas: Yes, breakout rooms, and I just let Ali in. So yeah.
Maia Hoffman: Cause. I got a message that if I reclaimed host I would compromise some of the. So okay.
Virag Gulyas: Yeah. All good.
Maia Hoffman: Okay, we're missing a couple of people. So the ones that were on time and early, I appreciate it.
Maia Hoffman: here is Rihanna's here. Right?
Maia Hoffman: Yeah, she's just
Maia Hoffman: Oh, is she not? I guess she's here.
Maia Hoffman: Hmm, okay, alright. So how many are we? Okay? There she is. There she is. Rihanna. Okay.
Raihaana Adira: Hi! How are you?
Maia Hoffman: Good! How are you?
Raihaana Adira: Good! Thank you. Excited to be here.
Maia Hoffman: Thank you. We're excited. You're here.
Maia Hoffman: Hold on, let's see one.
Maia Hoffman: Okay, so I think everybody's here except for one person.
Maia Hoffman: So we'll just wait one more minute and then we will start. I really appreciate everybody logging in. I'm sorry for my neurotic texts and emails. But you know, when I was working on the agenda yesterday, I was like, Oh, wait if I want to begin at one, so I appreciate it.
Maia Hoffman: Just wait until the clock strikes one, and then we will start. I'm gonna just I'm gonna just so you understand, like the lineup of today, like, I'm just gonna do some housekeeping, and then, okay.
Maia Hoffman: wait. What was that?
Maia Hoffman: I just clicked something.
Maia Hoffman: Thought I was letting somebody in.
Eli Ovits: Maya, can you rename yourself.
Ronnie Footlick: An hour.
Maia Hoffman: Can I name myself.
Eli Ovits: Rename.
Maia Hoffman: Yes, I can.
Ronnie Footlick: And then you'll be right back. Okay?
Maia Hoffman: Thank you, Ellie, for that.
Maia Hoffman: Okay, okay, alright.
Maia Hoffman: Okay, alright. So we are going to start. And then, the one or 2 people that are not here, I'm sure, will join virag if you could just put, you know or or do wait. I see somebody
Maia Hoffman: here. He is. Okay.
Maia Hoffman: We are now, officially all here.
Maia Hoffman: So the way it's gonna work is, I am going to do some housekeeping. And then, avi, avi, do you want to at least wave and say, Hello,
Maia Hoffman: Internet, hold on. Okay, all right. Okay. So
Maia Hoffman: alright. So 1st of all, thank you all for. Thank you all for coming. We're so excited. I'm gonna do introductions squirrel outside a little bit. But I just want to go through very quickly. Some. Oh, sorry I I'm sorry.
Maia Hoffman: 1st of all, I want to call on Carl Chiappa. I just jumped right in Carl Chiappa. Who most of you have met in the interviews, and for those of you that we haven't had personal interviews yet with I
Maia Hoffman: for those of you who have not had personal interviews yet, as I said to you, we will set them with our board members, but for those of you who have met Carl. He's someone we all love, and don't forget. So, Carl, just if you want to say
Maia Hoffman: something to kick us off.
CARL CHIAPPA: I I would be delighted to do that. 1st of all, as as Maya says, I have had the pleasure to meet most of you over the last couple of months I serve as the chair of the board of Itme. I've been involved with itme now, for I think almost a decade, and I've been very impressed as we have
CARL CHIAPPA: talked about the enthusiasm all of you have exhibited about learning about the Middle East, and especially impressed that, given your schedules, you're prepared to devote your spare time to learning more about the Middle East and about Israel's role in it.
CARL CHIAPPA: I
CARL CHIAPPA: I'm especially delighted and excited to be introducing you to the 1st session of the 1st cohort of Itme's fellowship program. I'm looking forward to getting to know all of you over the next couple of months, because I intend to attend all 12 sessions.
CARL CHIAPPA: and then the meeting in DC. I believe profoundly in Itme's educational mission, and although I have heard Avi speak many times over many years, I absolutely never fail to learn something new, or to have a new thought, and I think that all of you, as we go through the syllabus, are going to find the same thing.
CARL CHIAPPA: So I welcome all of you. I congratulate you and I look forward to our journey together.
Maia Hoffman: Thank you, Carl, and we are excited that all of you are here as well, those of you that we know well, and those of you that we will get to know. Well, so I'm just going to do a little bit of housekeeping, and I just wanted to say that
Maia Hoffman: if you. If we go a little bit over today, we're really going to try not to, because we know today is longer. But if we go a little bit longer during the Q. And A. And you have to leave. Please feel free. Just want to give you that heads up again. We're going to start. Do our best to end by 3 30. We will be filming today's session. But we're not going to publicize the 1st part of the session, but we want to be sure that you have access to the recordings of the sessions.
Maia Hoffman: So we will. So we will.
Maia Hoffman: We will have those on the portal available for you and Didier, as I always say, the guy that makes me look good, who you will meet. Will explain the portal to you as we later on in the session. So just very quick housekeeping things.
Maia Hoffman: we really, we're so happy. You're all with us today as we've had the conversations. We really encourage you. We really encourage you unless there's a conflict that you really can't come to participate in all the sessions. Please log in a few minutes early as we did today, so we can get started at one o'clock.
Maia Hoffman: Please keep your camera on unless there's an extenuating reason for a couple of minutes that you can't. But we really want to create a community here. So you know, we just love you to keep the camera on so Avi can see you and everyone else can see you because we're just excited to build this new cohort and seeing you as a really critical component of that most of the sessions, as you know today, it's only avi
Maia Hoffman: and this course is intended to provide you with the historical context and the current
Maia Hoffman: geopolitical happenings. To understand the Middle East to navigate, analyze, and understand the region today is going to be the historical background
Maia Hoffman: going forward. It's going to be the history plus the contemporary. So we really encourage you to please ask questions today with Avi only, and all of the others going forward, as you know, will be with the guests. So we really encourage you to ask questions during the Q. And a. The general format is, avi will do a briefing.
Maia Hoffman: and then and then Q&A. So that's the format today. Please ask questions of Avi as well as the speakers.
Maia Hoffman: Really quickly about the project. You all know we're doing a project. If you haven't chosen your project yet.
Maia Hoffman: Please. We really need it. By the 3rd of February, by the 3rd session, so that then, before the 9th of February, any questions issues, please be in touch with me. Each of you will be matched with a mentor. Once we have all your projects, we'll match you with mentors. That'll be on February 14, th I mean sorry. But February 16.th We need it. But by February 16th we'll we'll
Maia Hoffman: We will match you with your mentors. We're also, if it's okay. Gonna spend another 15 min. At the end of that session, just reviewing the projects so the at the end of the as we as we've shared with us, we've all shared with you as well. The last session will be in May. I will send you
Maia Hoffman: tomorrow. Today dates to choose from, and as we pulled you all for the best time for this for the sessions in general. We're going to poll you. We really want you to all come to DC. In May. So I will send an email. With those with with those dates. So yeah. So speaking of projects, we do have one. We do have one fellow, Miranda trying to find you on the screen, Miranda.
Maia Hoffman: I don't see her. Is she not here? Oh, there she is! You're right in the middle. How can I miss you? We do have one fellow, Miranda, who's already chosen her project, and I just want it involves all of you. So we're literally all of you. So, Miranda, please give us a short description of your project.
Miranda Ruzinsky: Hey, guys, my project is going to be part of gathering promotional materials for itme, and especially about this fellowship and what it is able to give to the community the impact it makes on y'all, the people who are everyone who's a part of it. And so my project will be involving doing a 15 min interview with each of the fellows, so that.
Maia Hoffman: Members and the Board members.
Miranda Ruzinsky: Yes, yes, for with everyone involved, really. But
Miranda Ruzinsky: speaking to the fellows, I've created a calendly sign up, I'm going to send it out over email. It's also going to be on the portal, and we'll put it in the Whatsapp where you can sign up for I put it in 30 min blocks. Just so we'll have time to get in. Set up. Do a 15 min interview. It's going to be recorded.
Miranda Ruzinsky: Really, there's no pressure. Just be yourselves, and I'm not expecting anything. And I think we're all here for a reason. So that's really what I want to document and record. And I'm excited to get to know every single one of you, and it's going to be from next Sunday through the end of April for a chance to sign up
Miranda Ruzinsky: and so I will contact you via email, just to get in touch as soon as you shine. Sign up. Probably the week that you sign up. And yeah, we'll go on from there.
Maia Hoffman: Okay, so thank you. Put it on. Put it on.
Maia Hoffman: yeah. Any. Thank you, Miranda. You have to put it on mute. Okay, anybody have any questions to Miranda or anything to me, that from what I just really quickly again.
Maia Hoffman: I was given clear directions. All of you all know that once I start talking I don't stop. So I was given clear directions. We've explained the fellowship to you. You have the syllabus not to go over that if anybody for those of you we haven't spoken with yet, then maybe you're kind of a little bit.
Maia Hoffman: you know, a little bit missing some dots we will definitely fill in those dots for you. I will email all of you, and we'll set a time to meet one on one with our leadership. But any questions about anything I said or anything. Miranda said.
Maia Hoffman: No.
Maia Hoffman: okay, alright on. Okay. So next, this is the exciting part the next part is, we really want to. Have everyone introduce themselves. So what we would like I'm going to start with the fellows.
Maia Hoffman: And what we would love is, you know, tell, you know. And this you have a minute. And I email, I whatsapped you all yesterday. So I'm not calling you off guard. You have 1 min. To kind of say your name, your school.
Maia Hoffman: and you know why you're, you know again, not everybody's met you so your name, school, and why you want to do this fellowship. And then I'm going to call on the board. So just so, you all know, I'm gonna give you 1 min to say
Maia Hoffman: who you are. You can say where you're from, not you can say what school you went to, if you'd like, but why, this fellowship is important to you.
Maia Hoffman: So everyone's got about a minute, and I'm just going to go around. This is not in any order. I'm just going around the boxes, Eli Rabinowitz, you're up.
Ilai R.: Hi, everyone. My name is Ellara Benowitz. I'm a freshman at Case Western Reserve University pre-med studying biochemistry and philosophy. I think a lot of us are here for a similar reason of seeing Avi. I had the privilege of also seeing Dahlia speak with him. My school is not really the most collaborative in terms of this conflict and speaking and having a sort of middle ground. So I'm hoping to get an environment where I can actually speak and have these conversations here in this fellowship. So, yeah.
Maia Hoffman: Aiden.
Aden Kosoi: Hey, guys, I'm Andy 1st year I actually went to Hofstra University. Now, I'm at
Aden Kosoi: a community college in Los Angeles.
Aden Kosoi: I chose this fellowship, I mean, but he's recommended me, and it was like, very like, quick, I was like, yes, I'm doing this because of just reading what everything was about. It was insane, and I've also
Aden Kosoi: done a lot of fellowships in like my short like year of college, and never seen anything like this one. So I'm really excited to be part of the 1st cohort.
Maia Hoffman: Thank you, Isaac.
Isaac Babus: Alright. Hi! My name is Isaac. I go to Lewis and Clark College at Portland, Oregon. I'm a junior, and I think the most important reason for me for why I joined the fellowship is.
Isaac Babus: I really appreciate education, and over the past summer I read Avi's whole book, so I really appreciated Avi's style of teaching, and by like teaching people how to think and not what to think. And that's something that I really resonated with. So I kind of want to embody that and bring that where I can.
Maia Hoffman: Anyone that reads Avi's whole book gets automatically invited to the fellowship Ben Monroe.
Ben Monroe: Hey, everyone! I'm Ben Monroe. I'm from Baltimore. I'm a Arabic and Hebrew major at the Ohio State University, a senior
Ben Monroe: I joined this pro program for the perspectives that we're going to be able to hear from Avi, from Maya, from the board, from our guest speakers, and also everyone else here. I'm really excited for that.
Maia Hoffman: Miranda.
Miranda Ruzinsky: Hi! I'm Miranda Rosenski. I'm a doctoral student at the University of Houston, studying history.
Miranda Ruzinsky: And I did this because I have as growing up in the American Jewish community never really talked about Israel in the Middle Eastern context, and I really thought it was revolutionary, and after hearing Avi's talk here in Houston. I knew I wanted to do this fellowship.
Maia Hoffman: Bori.
Ori Josell: Everyone. My name is Ori. I am a senior at Oberlin College. I'm from North Potomac, Maryland, and I'm studying jazz performance economics and environmental studies.
Ori Josell: and I jumped at the opportunity for the fellowship just because
Ori Josell: after October 7th happened, I really felt a sort of
Ori Josell: need to learn more about this issue just learn more about not only Israeli history, but the entire political reality of the Middle East, and my family has been living in Israel for a really long time, or at least some of them have, so I feel kind of a debt to my family to know more about what
Ori Josell: the you know the events that have formed my
Ori Josell: life, basically. So I'm glad to be here.
Maia Hoffman: Thank you.
Maia Hoffman: Tamar.
Tamar Weiss: Hi, I'm Tamar. I go to Columbia University. I'm studying political science, and I'm doing this fellowship because Avi came to speak to us and taught me information that I haven't even thought to like. Ask questions about, and also with the contentious political situation on our campus. I think the best weapon we have is to be well informed about the situation in the Middle East, full of misinformation. So I'm excited to learn more about it.
Maia Hoffman: Thank you, Matt.
Matthew Zivian: Hi! I'm Matthew Zivian. Sorry I'm a senior at Michigan State University. I'm a public relations, Major.
Matthew Zivian: I really want to take this fellowship because I engage in conversations about the Israeli Palestinian conflict a lot. And I love talking about the broader. You know, Middle East context. So getting to learn from Avi is just a great opportunity that I don't want to pass up on.
Maia Hoffman: I wish I wish I could tell all the stories behind all of you. But I'm not allowed, and a good story is Sam also. So, Samantha, Sam, Sam, do you go by Sam? Actually, Matt, do you go by Matthew or Matt.
Matthew Zivian: Either works.
Maia Hoffman: Got it. Okay. And Sam, are you Sam or Samantha?
Samantha Abdoo: I go by both, too. Either one works.
Maia Hoffman: I thought I just wanted to be sure.
Samantha Abdoo: I'm Samantha. I go to the University of Cincinnati in Ohio. I'm studying English and political science. I'm a freshman.
Samantha Abdoo: and I joined the fellowship because I met Maya and Avi at Ohio, Israel Conference back in October, September, somewhere around there, and we just got really excited about being able to
Samantha Abdoo: learn about the Middle East with a bunch of young people. And I think
Samantha Abdoo: the reason why I'm here is because I want to be more confident in what I know about the Middle East, and be able to share that with other people.
Maia Hoffman: Thank you, Brooklyn.
Brooklyn Tory: Hi! I'm Brooklyn. I'm in my last year of undergrad at Mcgill University, in Montreal I met Maya and Avi when they came to visit and speak at Mcgill, and I was just really interested, by their way of sort of presenting the situation more globally.
Brooklyn Tory: not globally, but as a region as opposed to specifically about Israel, and I think a lot of people at my school are very interested in jumping to conclusions and memorizing talking points that support their stance, and really just arguing their own state of mind as opposed to really thinking and
Brooklyn Tory: talking through things and being willing to sort of discuss more rationally. So. I'm hopeful that by doing this I can be a part of a community that's starting to be more willing to speak.
Maia Hoffman: Thank you. I'm gonna change. Because there's 1 person I really want to say hello to that. I want him to introduce himself, and he has to to leave. So Jeff Blavitt, you're not gonna get off without saying something. I know you have 2 min. So I really want you to introduce them. Because you're why we're here in so many ways.
Jeffrey Blavatt: That's very kind of you. I just want to introduce. My name is Jeffrey Blavitt. I had the good fortune of serving as the executive director of the Eisenhower Institute, which is part of Gettysburg College, and was allied with 10 different institutions across the country that had some
Jeffrey Blavatt: relationship to President Eisenhower. The most important part for you all on for us is that we had the good fortune to have Ali Muhammad as our expert in residence at Gettysburg College and the Eisenhower Institute, and it was very similar. It was a lot of years ago, it seems like, but the the relevance for you all is that it's very much a fellowship like your guys are beginning now. So it was an experience that was
Jeffrey Blavatt: co-curricular. There was experiential learning, as somebody already mentioned. The key to it all was obvious, and is an amazing dynamic educator. But he had incredible young people who had vision, strength, and the ability to really see the importance of
Jeffrey Blavatt: being ambassadors for truth, objectivity, and all that. So I feel very, very fortunate to have met up along the way with the other Board members that you've you'll get to meet here as well. But I say this from the bottom of my heart. I am so passionate about what you all are undertaking. And again, I think somebody else already mentioned this. There are many fellowships out there, but the the in-depthness of this, and the practicality and the importance of it. The timing is is just
Jeffrey Blavatt: wonderful. It's a wonderful opportunity for you, but it's also a great opportunity for Avi's.
Jeffrey Blavatt: Beth will tell you this, but the malamed method of educating through experience and objective reasoning and media literacy. It's just now is the time. So again, I apologize for running one of my sons is in a Lego robotics competition. I don't even really know what that means. But I, you know, know that parenting is 90% showing up, so I'm going to show up. Be quiet! You are in good hands with everyone here. But again I don't mean to ramble, but this is a passion and exciting adventure, and Avi is the perfect leader.
Maia Hoffman: Thank you, Jeff. Enjoy Lego. Okay. Now we're back to our regularly scheduled introductions. Aaliyah.
Aliya Zigman: Hi, guys, I'm aaliyah I'm a senior at the University of Denver, studying psychology and philosophy. I should mention right now I'm really sick. So if I like, turn my camera off, I'm like
Aliya Zigman: hacking away and doing my thing. But I'm still here. Okay, so but I I met Avi and Maya. I was in Israel for 10 months last year, studying or not studying. I was volunteering in the North, and on October 7th they like.
Aliya Zigman: I don't want to say they saved my life because that day was pretty drastic, and you don't want to use that word lightly, but they did help me out a lot.
Aliya Zigman: and then we just became very close, and I brought them to come. Speak at Du a few times, and they've it's so incredible like Avi's method is insane and so impactful. And so it just was such an obvious choice to come and join this fellowship. And Isaac, I really resonated with what you said about how Avi teaches how to think, not what to think. And I think that that's what's so important and
Aliya Zigman: sorry. I'm very. I'm gonna yes.
Maia Hoffman: Thank you. Thanks, Brianna.
Raihaana Adira: Hi! My name is Rehanadira. I'm in my second to last year at Mcgill University as well like Brooklyn. The situation at Mcgill is interesting, to say the least. And by that I mean, I've sued the school multiple Times and a lot of my professors. I'm an Islamic Studies minor
Raihaana Adira: and every single professor I've had in the program is affiliated with the terrorist organization in some way, shape or form. So as someone that's pursuing this academically and feels that I'm not getting a fair or objective education, and Israel is highly left out of the curriculum. I felt like this would be a
Raihaana Adira: opportunity to learn something and meet some cool people. So I'm really grateful to be here.
Maia Hoffman: Thank you. You'll see.
Yossi Moff: Hi! I'm Yosi. I'm a sophomore at Yale, studying statistics and data science.
Yossi Moff: And I am. I'm just. I'm very excited to be able to have this Israel education that's framed in a much broader way than I think. A lot of other programs or messages are. And I think that's something that both I myself are missing, and a lot of people
Yossi Moff: around me are missing as well as a is a sort of contextualization of everything. So I'm very excited to have that both for myself, and and and to be able to learn from and with
Yossi Moff: obvious throughout this fellowship, and then to be able to bring that back to campus. So thank you for putting this together.
Maia Hoffman: Thank you. The huge.
Bahij Said: Hey, everyone! My name is, I study at the University of Maryland, Arabic, Persian, and International Affairs. The reason I joined the fellowship was to learn more about the Middle East, from people from the Middle East.
Maia Hoffman: Wow! That was concise. Jason.
jason diebner: Hello, everyone! My name is Jason. I'm a senior at the University of Texas at Austin. I wanted to join the fellowship because we had Avi and Maya come to our campus sometimes last semester, and I was just like astounded by how good of a speaker Avi was, and how much I learned, and I really wanted to come and and be a part of this. So thanks.
Maia Hoffman: Thank you.
Maia Hoffman: Jonah, right.
Jonah Rosen: Hi! How are you? I'm very happy to be part of the fellowship. I learned a lot from Avi Melamed's recordings, and also my friend Bahij told me a little bit about the fellowship. My name is Jonah Rosen, and I'm doing University of Arizona right now online because they did it on campus for one year. But now I'm doing it online. I'm also studying in Poland right now.
Jonah Rosen: But I was always involved in Jewish activism with organizations such as SSI collaborating with Aipac or other Jewish organizations, and I thought this fellowship would be great for me to learn more about the Middle East and be a better defender and a provider of peace for the Jewish people in Israel abroad. So I'm very happy to join the group today, and I hope I'm going to learn even more. Thank you.
Maia Hoffman: Thank you.
Maia Hoffman: Miles.
Miles Isaacs: I apologize if I
Miles Isaacs: I may need to listen out to any announcement. I'm just in the airport at the moment.
Miles Isaacs: But my name is Miles. I'm from London. I study philosophy, politics, and law at King's
Miles Isaacs: College, London, and I run an on-campus. Think, Tank.
Miles Isaacs: where I reached out to Dahlia to ask if she wanted to come and speak. I was referred to Hussein Mansour and avi I got to know avi, and you Maya closer and then was offered the opportunity to do this. The reason I chose to do it
Miles Isaacs: was.
Miles Isaacs: I think, primarily because I was strong in in outward advocacy, and less so in in educational, I mean, I knew my education, but there's always room to know more.
Maia Hoffman: Thank you. And just to fill in the blank for those of you that don't know Dahlia. She's like cher for those of you that don't know Dahlia. Her name is Dahlia Ziada. She's an Egyptian
Maia Hoffman: Egyptian activist, and she will be in one of the sessions as well later down the road. But I just wanted everyone keeps mentioning the word Dahlia for those that don't know her. But Dalia Ziada and you will meet her, and then she will be dahlia to all of you as well. Okay, now I we are turning to the board and again going around the romper room that you guys are too young to remember that
Maia Hoffman: Beth Goldsmith, please.
Maia Hoffman: Oh, Beth! Oh, wait a second. So who you are.
Maia Hoffman: you know, whatever else you want to add, and why this fellowship is is important to you.
beth goldsmith: I'm Beth Goldsmith and
beth goldsmith: I have known Avi almost to Jeff's beginnings. I met him through the Eisenhower Institute, and
beth goldsmith: inside the Middle East has just been
beth goldsmith: evolving over all these years into so much more than I think any of us ever dreamt that it could be. I've had the pleasure and privilege of learning. With Avi, I would never turn down an opportunity to continue to do that. I was an educator myself
beth goldsmith: in a previous lifetime. I went to Goucher College, which was an all women's college back then, and then for graduate school, also to Johns Hopkins, and my degrees are in psychology and education. And I'm very much involved in my community on a volunteer basis. So the more I learn
beth goldsmith: the more I can share. And that's exactly why I'm excited to be here. I hope to meet all of you. I've met a few of you in the interviews. I hope to see all of you in DC.
Maia Hoffman: Thank you.
Maia Hoffman: Carl, do you want to say anything else than what you've said?
Maia Hoffman: You're muted. You're muted good.
CARL CHIAPPA: I was coughing, too, and I'm also notorious for my technological incompetence. No, I think we could
CARL CHIAPPA: move right along, Maya. Thank you for the opportunity, though.
Maia Hoffman: Okay. Ronnie.
Ronnie Footlick: Hi, I'm Ronnie Footlich. I'm a retired businesswoman and a long time learner of history. I was a History Poli sci minor
Ronnie Footlick: at the University of Maryland, and my whole thinking has been governed by the historical perspectives that I was taught while in college, and I think we've lost so much of that. There are 2 or 3 generations that have screwed things up royally.
Ronnie Footlick: and have left the hard work of the future to all of our fellows, and I have great confidence that they will take what they gather from Avi.
Ronnie Footlick: Going forward. They'll be more informed. I've been involved with inside the Middle East almost from the beginning, as it was a dream and a dream that I very strongly support. I'm very, very proud of Avi and Maya. I knew Maya when she was a much younger little girl.
Ronnie Footlick: and she has risen to the occasion. So I look forward to getting to know all of you, and I have such great faith in you.
Maia Hoffman: Thank you, Ronnie. Eliovitz.
Eli Ovits: Hello, friends, Hello! From Jerusalem.
Eli Ovits: I serve on the board of Itme as the President, which means I do what Maya tells me to do.
Eli Ovits: and Maya does what Avi tells her to do, and we all get along perfectly. This this is really very exciting.
Eli Ovits: Oh, as someone who's a big proponent of lifelong
Eli Ovits: learning. I'm excited to just garner any knowledge from this fellowship, including from each of you and each and every one of you. We can learn a lot, I would just say, come with a spirit of listening, of really engaging, of feeling, you know, wrestling with the discomfort, if something you might not know or disagree with. And when you bring that together.
Eli Ovits: that knowledge, those skills and the confidence we're going to have a whole new generation of leaders coming out of this fellowship, so I'm very excited for what it will produce. We're excited to get to know some of you, all of you, I hope, and
Eli Ovits: over to you, Maya.
Maia Hoffman: Thank you. So there are.
Maia Hoffman: There are 3 people that haven't spoken yet.
Maia Hoffman: Avi! You'll hear from him. Didier, you'll hear from him. And virag you will hear from her as well. But right now what we want to do is we want to give you all time to talk to each other a little bit without us.
Maia Hoffman: So so virag is going to magically. She's my helper because I am tech compromised in every way. So virag is going to put you all into breakout rooms that I'm sure you all have much more experience than I do. So you know how it works. We're gonna give you. We're gonna give you 8 to 9 min
Maia Hoffman: and we're probably going to do 2 rounds today, we want to keep on time to be respectful of you all.
Maia Hoffman: So if we don't get if you don't, but we want everyone to meet everybody. So if we don't get everybody today, we want to, we will over the next 2 weeks. Maybe we'll add another 10 min onto next week's session or log in 10 min early. We want you all to meet each other, but we'll see what we can get accomplished today. So, virag, do you want to say anything about that.
Virag Gulyas: No, it just you're gonna get into your rooms. And in the chat right now you have some icebreaking questions, so that should be the goal to answer those. I will go through each room. So if you are not seeing the questions I'm more than happy to repeat there, and just enjoy. Get to know each other in more depth.
Virag Gulyas: See you in 8 min after.
Virag Gulyas: Okay, you guys still hear me here? Yes, so they are the breakout sessions.
Eli Ovits: Wow! Wow! They're odd, right? Right?
Eli Ovits: I mean, we're the we're the All, the all the alumni in this room. I think.
Virag Gulyas: Last time I was called all already. So I'm like, I don't know what to do. But anyway, so now you have free time, they're gonna be back automatically within 8 min. I'm gonna go into each group now to make sure that you know they are on track. And they know the questions, and within 8 min, you know, we're gonna be done and back.
Virag Gulyas: So enjoy your time.
Maia Hoffman: So let me let me just think. Here.
Eli Ovits: Question for you, maya.
Maia Hoffman: Yeah.
Eli Ovits: The idea of a press release announcing the launch of the Fellowship. Is that something you wanted to do.
Maia Hoffman: Yes, but I don't. Anyway, I we talked about it. We we met you mentioned it yesterday.
Maia Hoffman: no, and yeah, so we will. We will talk to to Josh about it.
Maia Hoffman: I just want to think about the timing.
Maia Hoffman: If we have, it's 1 35, Carl. I kept it completely on time. Do I get like a little bit of? Did I get some credit.
CARL CHIAPPA: Big big gold star.
Maia Hoffman: I didn't talk too much. I didn't.
CARL CHIAPPA: Get it all.
Maia Hoffman: Chat from Carl, saying, Maya, we don't want to hear.
Ronnie Footlick: I'm gonna send you a home and passion.
CARL CHIAPPA: I am.
Maia Hoffman: I am like completely on time. 1 35 was supposed to be the the the chat, the breakout rooms, and it was, and thank.
CARL CHIAPPA: Don't you feel? Don't you feel wonderful about this discipline? It's terrific.
Maia Hoffman: I? Yeah, I have to tell. Yes, and I thank you for you know you're I'm scared of you, you know. So that helps. By the way, I don't know. Do you? Did Beth and Ronnie? Maybe you remember
Maia Hoffman: we do. You remember that you wouldn't remember me? That did it, most likely. But do you remember that there was a big women's seder at Bethel.
Ronnie Footlick: Yes.
Maia Hoffman: Beth, were you there?
beth goldsmith: No.
Maia Hoffman: So I was in charge of that event. I had also just broken up with the boyfriend, so I was very skinny. I was wearing Shoshana Carden's gown at this thing, so you can imagine how much thinner I was, anyway. So I had.
Maia Hoffman: I literally. And, Carl, I have to show you one day when I used to do missions, how I typed every single thing out!
Maia Hoffman: But I remember that we had this whole event, and I really typed the whole thing out, and at 1 point Melissa Cordish was on. The was on the committee, and I went over to her. We were halfway through or 3 quarters of the way through, and I showed her the agenda and the time. And I was like we are on time. But today was today was harder, in a way, because I didn't know how long everyone was going to talk.
Maia Hoffman: you know. But I think this the kids really stayed on, you know I gave them all the question yesterday, so they were prepared for it. So everybody really spoke short, and you all spoke short, so that really helped so.
CARL CHIAPPA: By the way.
beth goldsmith: Maya. It was quite incredible that well, one guy was in the airport, but the the young man who said he was in Poland was obviously on some sort of public train, like a train or a bus.
Maia Hoffman: I don't, I know. So I actually.
Maia Hoffman: I don't know where he is, but it's very interesting. Actually, because I
Maia Hoffman: he was. He was he was
Maia Hoffman: recommended by Bahij the Saudi. So that so you all know, there's a Saudi guy that's Bahij, and there's so he's Sunni, and then we have Rihanna who is the Shiite Iranian girl? So Bahij recommended a couple of people. Jonah was one.
Maia Hoffman: and the communication with him was not very good, and I sent him a Whatsapp last night, and whatever, and then and then he sent me a message this morning because he's not, you know. Send in any materials. He didn't. You know I have nothing on him, and so I. So this morning, he said, I don't think I can come today, and I'd asked him last week if he could come.
Maia Hoffman: So I emailed him. And I said, I understand completely.
Maia Hoffman: But I think, considering the fact, I haven't gotten your materials, and you can't. And given the fact that you can't come, I suggest you just reapply for next cohort, and I and I felt so good that I actually, I said to Avi, just I kick that kid out. I was so proud of myself. I've never done that before. I felt so good, and then he showed up.
Maia Hoffman: I don't know where he is. I don't know if he's in Poland or.
beth goldsmith: Well, I thought, that's what he said, yeah. Well.
Maia Hoffman: Don't!
beth goldsmith: Hold on!
CARL CHIAPPA: That's what I understood.
beth goldsmith: Yeah.
CARL CHIAPPA: I understood he was.
Maia Hoffman: Polish. The message to me was, he doesn't use his Polish phone. So I don't really. So you think he was in Poland?
CARL CHIAPPA: That's what I thought and what.
beth goldsmith: That's what he said.
CARL CHIAPPA: And wasn't miles in Amsterdam, or something.
Maia Hoffman: Miles was in Amsterdam, and flying back to to England, to London, and he told me that his flight was 20 min delayed.
beth goldsmith: He might have to go off.
Maia Hoffman: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
beth goldsmith: Maya, what's with your fingers, babe.
Maia Hoffman: So 3 weeks ago I made a cup of tea, and it was really hot, and it was a big mug, and it cracked all the way down on the handle, the whole handle cracked, and I got like hot water, so it's better now. I'm just trying to now keep it covered. So it'll heal because it's like scarred. So I'm putting like stuff on it. So hopefully, yeah, yeah. So that's been my
Maia Hoffman: my life for the past couple of weeks.
Maia Hoffman: What was.
Ronnie Footlick: Is there any concern about why he didn't turn in his information.
Maia Hoffman: What do you mean?
Ronnie Footlick: I mean, did he have a a legitimate reason.
Maia Hoffman: What he told me was that his message to me when he joined. Actually, I didn't know he was coming, because literally, I said, see ya and and he said the the Whatsapp he got from me is
Maia Hoffman: is was that he didn't use his Polish phone.
Maia Hoffman: I don't know what that means. So.
beth goldsmith: And get your information.
Maia Hoffman: That's what I think he was trying to say, like I didn't, which, whatever we'll see, I mean, you know, we'll see what happens. I mean, yeah.
beth goldsmith: Was the question that Ronnie asked
beth goldsmith: made me think as well, about which I had been thinking about ever since. Ellie asked about
beth goldsmith: pr announcement like, are we worried at all on all these campuses where there are issues? To begin with
beth goldsmith: that, you know, we are stoking some fire.
Maia Hoffman: Stoking some fire.
CARL CHIAPPA: I I do. We do. We mean, someone who who might not share our views. Here, Amal.
CARL CHIAPPA: correct.
CARL CHIAPPA: That's where.
beth goldsmith: Yeah, I thought that was sort of what Ron
beth goldsmith: intimating, because, like, is anybody here for exactly the wrong reason?
beth goldsmith: Are we leaving ourselves open. Are we leaving Avi open in any way to you? Know
beth goldsmith: something not so good.
CARL CHIAPPA: We should be able to do some kind of a background check quickly online, can't we? I.
Maia Hoffman: I mean, look, the people that we've spoken with
Maia Hoffman: none of the I mean, you know. Rehana actually asked me if there were any, if they were all Zionists or any, she said, pro pallies in the cohort, and it was interesting because I didn't know how to answer that question. And
Maia Hoffman: but I said, Look from what we have the conversation we've had with people.
Maia Hoffman: you know. We don't think so, but Avi made wanted me to make it very clear to her that we don't ask
Maia Hoffman: those kinds of questions. And her response was very funny. Actually, her response was a hopefully next time, because they could use some education.
Maia Hoffman: but that was like a very cute. I didn't know why she was asking. I thought she was nervous about it, but she was asking, because it would be great to have them a part of it. Oh, Ellie's back.
Maia Hoffman: okay, so we'll do
Maia Hoffman: So we definitely have time to do, we may be we definitely have time to do another one.
Virag Gulyas: Okay, I'm closing the rooms now. They're gonna come back. So just message me when you think the next one should be. In the meantime, I put them in different groups.
Virag Gulyas: Okay, so that they are not in the same group.
Maia Hoffman: Yeah, yeah.
Virag Gulyas: Okay, can I bring them back like it's gonna take like, 50 seconds, more or less.
Maia Hoffman: Do you bring them all back? And then they go out again.
Maia Hoffman: Do you see the close now? Do you have the close now on your screen? Do you see that.
Virag Gulyas: Yes, and I will need, so speak, and talk at least for 3 min or 2 min, because I need to rearrange the names. It's not automatic. So give me a bit so that they are not in the same group. So just talk about something.
Maia Hoffman: Miles is not here anymore. I don't think.
Virag Gulyas: Okay.
CARL CHIAPPA: I'll be right back.
Maia Hoffman: Okay, so that was one round.
Virag Gulyas: Yeah, they are slowly coming back.
Maia Hoffman: So I think.
Virag Gulyas: They still have like 20 seconds. Some of them are coming.
Maia Hoffman: I'm just. I'm thinking about the time. I think we'll only have one. I think we'll do just one more, and then we'll let avi take over, so we can keep on time. If we have time at the end, we'll do another one.
Virag Gulyas: Sure.
beth goldsmith: Maya, while we're asking that, do you guys have
beth goldsmith: may thoughts in terms of DC, like dates.
Maia Hoffman: So we're thinking the last sometime in the last 2 weeks of May.
beth goldsmith: Okay.
Maia Hoffman: Yeah. Towards the end, we wanna make sure that
Ronnie Footlick: Just avoid mother's Day.
Maia Hoffman: Oh, no, it's after mother's day. I wouldn't do that. That's that's dangerous. That's living on the edge here. So.
Ronnie Footlick: Right.
Maia Hoffman: I wouldn't do that.
beth goldsmith: I'm terrible about that. I don't celebrate mother's day anymore because I don't have a mother.
Virag Gulyas: Okay.
Maia Hoffman: Yeah, but someone should celebrate for you.
beth goldsmith: It's true, but I I it just
beth goldsmith: since I lost my parents. I don't celebrate mother's day or father's day, just.
Maia Hoffman: Yeah.
Miles Isaacs: I think I can say that sorry about my cameras off. I think I can say that we will celebrate it in different ways, regardless of, if you're not physically celebrating it or not, even not celebrating it, and knowing that the day is still, there is still significant enough.
beth goldsmith: Love that you just said that that was really quite beautiful.
Virag Gulyas: Yeah.
beth goldsmith: Thank you.
Miles Isaacs: That's okay.
Miles Isaacs: Yeah, that was really beautiful.
Eli Ovits: We love. We love the British representation on the fellowship.
Maia Hoffman: Making you look good.
beth goldsmith: He's not just a pretty face, with a cool accent.
Miles Isaacs: Oh, no, it's true, it's true, though.
Virag Gulyas: It is. It is right.
beth goldsmith: True. That's why it resonated with us.
Miles Isaacs: Good.
Maia Hoffman: Okay, so where did Vera go?
Virag Gulyas: Oh, I'm here!
CARL CHIAPPA: Did she?
Virag Gulyas: Right here.
Maia Hoffman: Yeah, sorry. I've.
Virag Gulyas: I'm almost done. So we're good guys.
Maia Hoffman: We're going to do one more round.
Maia Hoffman: that's all we're gonna have time for today.
Maia Hoffman: Then we're gonna do 2 quick things. Virag Didier is going to, just as Virag is magically putting you all into rooms. Didier, after the after the next round, is going to introduce the portal that we've all been talking. I'm sure you all are on pins and needles about what this portal is, so Didier will do. An over, will introduce himself and do an overview of the portal, and then and then virag who is our
Maia Hoffman: social media?
Maia Hoffman: Guru, particularly Instagram, is going to talk about our new Instagram account for the fellowship and talk about some other stuff. And then
Maia Hoffman: we're gonna be finished with this part. And then we're gonna get on to Avi, which is really why you are all all here. So.
Virag Gulyas: Good. Okay, I'm ready with the rooms just enjoy the second round.
Maia Hoffman: Check, magic.
Virag Gulyas: Okay.
Virag Gulyas: Good.
Maia Hoffman: Wow!
Maia Hoffman: Miles, yeah, miles is still here. I thought he had to.
Maia Hoffman: Sorry.
Virag Gulyas: Okay, so sorry, assigning you right now.
Maia Hoffman: Sorry about that. That was my fault. I thought he was boarding.
Virag Gulyas: Don't worry.
Virag Gulyas: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, wait a second. I might as I'm struggling to.
Virag Gulyas: What do you mean?
Miles Isaacs: No worries, no worries.
Maia Hoffman: Sorry about that. It was my fault.
Miles Isaacs: No, you said me.
Maia Hoffman: Picture. Now I thought Pick, I thought you said you were boarding so.
Miles Isaacs: Yeah, we all we all. I'm just
Miles Isaacs: like it says board. It says boarding but they're still here, just taking time.
Virag Gulyas: Okay.
Maia Hoffman: There is it? But.
Virag Gulyas: Good guy, it's so adorable! Oh, my goodness! So cute.
Maia Hoffman: Yeah,
Maia Hoffman: So what were we talking about before? Avi anything you want to say.
CARL CHIAPPA: We were we were talking about May.
Maia Hoffman: Oh, right. So I think it's going to be the last 2 weeks of May. There is one challenge which is Oberlin, apparently not, apparently, but the boy from Oberlin Ori told me that they are in class till the 26th of May. I'm a little bit nervous about after Memorial Day. But again, you know, I will pull them and see what they say. I was hoping it could have been that week of the 18th
Maia Hoffman: so and as a locate as a location
Maia Hoffman: Carl has offered to try to have
Maia Hoffman: to use his superpowers to have us have the session at Hogan Lovells. Offices in Washington. So
Maia Hoffman: so that's very exciting. We're very grateful for that.
CARL CHIAPPA: It's it's my pleasure, and they certainly have
CARL CHIAPPA: enough conference rooms. They're going to. The 1st thing they're going to ask me is, how many people.
CARL CHIAPPA: What? What should I say? 25, or 30? What
CARL CHIAPPA: the 2 questions you can all chime in on this? We need the number.
CARL CHIAPPA: Do you want it done?
CARL CHIAPPA: Because this is all the questions I will get immediately. Do you want individual tables, or is that gonna look like too much of a cocktail party, or do we want rows? Anyone have a sense of how? What kind of a room you have.
Maia Hoffman: Personally, would love a big conference table if possible. If that's.
CARL CHIAPPA: Like like a like a like a UN kind of thing, you know, with you a big.
CARL CHIAPPA: a big you know, empty space in the middle. And a big okay, how many people.
Maia Hoffman: So look, we have currently fellows wise with Jonah that showed up. That I didn't expect, you know. Look we again, may we may have attrition, as we know and we may not. Everybody may be able to.
CARL CHIAPPA: Go slightly.
Maia Hoffman: The current. The current number is 7 is hold on is 8 is 9.th
Maia Hoffman: I mean, hold on 1719, yeah, 17 is the current number of fellows.
CARL CHIAPPA: Better that we we.
beth goldsmith: Talking about adding the the board.
Maia Hoffman: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
CARL CHIAPPA: What's my starting line.
Maia Hoffman: Thinking about right.
Maia Hoffman: I was just starting with that number, because that's a static number. And then I think Ellie's gonna probably be here at that time, and then we hope again, Ronnie and Beth, that.
beth goldsmith: Yeah, so it sounds. It sounds like you'd be safe to say 30. Carl.
CARL CHIAPPA: Yeah, that's it.
CARL CHIAPPA: What? I thought, okay, so we'll say 25 to 30.
Maia Hoffman: And we'll also look the educators that can come. We would.
Maia Hoffman: Which may only be Hussein Dahlia heavy.
Maia Hoffman: I don't know who else lives in the Us.
CARL CHIAPPA: I bet say 30.
Maia Hoffman: Yeah, we're not gonna obviously fly in people from overseas. But we definitely want the ones that are here to be able to come, if possible. So yeah, I say, 30 sounds like a good, a good number.
CARL CHIAPPA: Okay, I I will. Matter of fact.
CARL CHIAPPA: To be honest, I'm I'm very glad you reminded me, because though they've got loads of conference rooms. They they fill up, and this one is, presumably one of the bigger ones. So I'll I'll I will talk to them tomorrow if I can.
Maia Hoffman: Okay.
Maia Hoffman: But I think that the I mean, I think the group is looks really cool. I mean.
Maia Hoffman: I'm so excited about this new opportunity.
beth goldsmith: By the way.
beth goldsmith: said this when you asked me to say something, but I didn't know how great it would go over with the kids. But you know how in our early board meetings, particularly when Eisenhower Institute was disappearing from our lives, and we always talked about getting Avi on more campuses and how we needed to clone Avi. And that was I. It was thinking that way. That that's the point
beth goldsmith: of these people. You know that that we hope, and you know. And so Ronnie said, and I I mean we all try to at least allude to like. This is a message that you need to.
Eli Ovits: Cause, you know.
beth goldsmith: I will say, Beth, you're the hope you're the hope.
Eli Ovits: I will say one common theme is the line between education and advocacy
Eli Ovits: is something. All these students want to be advocates, and we're teaching them. We're not
Eli Ovits: trying to get them to become advocates, but that's what they're going to do with the knowledge. So it's interesting.
Eli Ovits: even though that's not our raison d'etre.
beth goldsmith: I'm sorry. I also thought it was really interesting that a number of them said there really isn't anywhere else that they can have this kind of a conversation.
beth goldsmith: That they really want to be able to talk about it in a
beth goldsmith: an sort of an open forum without all the you know, the nasties.
Maia Hoffman: I think that the really unique opportunity about this, what differentiates it from Gettysburg and Capitol Hill. And really, anything that we're doing is that just what you all said, these people are advocates. They want to be better advocates, and what we need them to walk away with is the understanding that
Maia Hoffman: in order to understand Israel, you have to understand the Middle East if we can. And I and I actually have that on the front of the Powerpoint with something we typically never put front and center.
Maia Hoffman: But I want them to understand that, like on it, to be framed that way.
Maia Hoffman: Because I think if we can have these emerging young Jewish leaders, which I think we all agree that these are having that
Maia Hoffman: philosophy and that mindset, that is how we can really make a difference in in the way that people approach Israel advocacy. So I think it's a great up with the 1st time ever, actually that we can be like, really honest about our mission. You know what I mean, and and giving them these tools to improve their advocacy. We're not trying to replace anything. But so for me, it's very, very exciting.
Maia Hoffman: Carl. Did you want to say something before.
CARL CHIAPPA: Well, I I did have a question just because I've kept notes about everything. Where does alias Zigmund go? I've I've I missed.
Maia Hoffman: University on the on the spreadsheet that I sent.
CARL CHIAPPA: Do.
Maia Hoffman: Information,
CARL CHIAPPA: I mean by.
Maia Hoffman: By the way, we're gonna take a minute break
Maia Hoffman: before you begin, because I've apparently they have. We have to give minute breaks and cloud, but it makes sense. They've been. I mean to go to the restroom, whatever. So.
CARL CHIAPPA: Ask me if there is.
Maia Hoffman: Actually, Ellie brought it up too, yesterday.
CARL CHIAPPA: To tell you, but there were never any such breaks when I went to school. I,
CARL CHIAPPA: Carl, I cannot believe that
CARL CHIAPPA: the absolute truth that it's not just my fading memory. If you would walk out of one of the classes, they would have assumed that you were, you know, going to the hospital.
Eli Ovits: Okay.
CARL CHIAPPA: Or it was a silent form of protest about something the Professor had just.
Maia Hoffman: Okay.
Virag Gulyas: The closeout rooms are the sessions closing.
Maia Hoffman: So Didier, you're up next
Maia Hoffman: and then virag, and then and then I think, avi you will.
Maia Hoffman: I didier. I just have a question I asked you. I want to clarify.
didier bodin: Yes.
Maia Hoffman: Oh, I know we got. We got totally off the mole issue. That's what we were talking about. We got totally.
Virag Gulyas: Oh yes!
CARL CHIAPPA: We should pick that up later.
Maia Hoffman: Yeah, yeah, yeah, we should. Didier, you can do speaker view right on the recording.
Maia Hoffman: I asked you that question on Whatsapp. Do you not remember.
didier bodin: Yes, but this has to be set up from within the zoom.
didier bodin: because then I can choose which recording I want to use.
Maia Hoffman: But you have to set it up beforehand.
didier bodin: Usually I think the speaker view is always by default.
Maia Hoffman: Okay, that's fine.
didier bodin: But Gerard, could you check 1st the the settings of the zoom, internal recordings.
Virag Gulyas: The recordings will always show the speaker.
Maia Hoffman: Okay.
didier bodin: Yeah.
Maia Hoffman: Okay, so that's fine.
Maia Hoffman: That's good.
didier bodin: That's something I cannot use. Change right now.
Maia Hoffman: No, it's in the 5,000,
Maia Hoffman: the 5,000 voice mails I left you that must have gone.
didier bodin: Yeah, usually we set it up for the webinar we need to be sure that these settings also apply to the regular meetings.
Maia Hoffman: Ron's everybody back.
Virag Gulyas: Yes.
Maia Hoffman: Okay, cool, alright guys. Thank you. So we hope that that
Maia Hoffman: you got to learn something. And so like, I said, what we'll do is if we have time at the end. We'll do another round, and if not, then we'll complete it over the next week or 2.
Maia Hoffman: okay. So what we're gonna do is didier is going to speak. Barack's gonna speak. We're then gonna take a minute, break
Maia Hoffman: not a minute, 5 min, 5 min or however long minutes to, you know whatever. Take a break, and then we'll and then avi will begin the session.
Maia Hoffman: So didier, or as I didier, as I always say, the guy that makes us look good, or the Jacques of all trades, because he's French. So, Didier.
Maia Hoffman: you're up.
didier bodin: Nice to meet you all, so I'm from France, as you can hear. I started to work with I. In a way, I'm kind of one of the 1st fellows, or long time long term, fellows, for itme I started working with in 2020 during the Corona, and we started with a website, then making hundreds of maps for the books
didier bodin: with Maya. Then we did some editing on the 1st documentaries. Then we started to co-produce the second documentary then rolling up on any graphic design or or animated design or product design, even when we need some pieces of jewelry for it. So so it's really like Jack. Of all trades, like when there is an issue there is a need to produce. We go and get the people, or we do it ourselves, including the portal
didier bodin: that we created for you. So now I'm gonna share my screen and show you the the portal on the website.
didier bodin: you need the maya to allow me to share with you.
Maia Hoffman: Think about it.
Maia Hoffman: Okay, go ahead. Go ahead.
didier bodin: Okay, good.
didier bodin: So I'll leave it a second to be sure that you can see my screen.
Maia Hoffman: You're in editing mode. You know that.
didier bodin: Yeah, I know.
Maia Hoffman: Okay.
didier bodin: Nope.
didier bodin: good. So when you live on the website on the link that we're gonna send you, yeah, you can see access on the top
didier bodin: the the rest of the pages of the website.
didier bodin: So the item Itme fellowship web portal description of the course introduction of Avi. Here you have the filler a copy of the syllabus.
didier bodin: Here you're gonna find a link to Miranda's calendar. Here you have a link to meet the fellows. That's a page where we we put a description of each of the participants, including their resume. And this is gonna be a link to
didier bodin: to discover the educators week after week. So for now it's avi, and next week you're gonna meet this, the 1st educator. So every week we're gonna add content on these pages. Here you always have a copy of the link to the zoom for each session.
didier bodin: and after and before and after each session you have like, 1st on this page of an introduction to each of the session topic, and so on.
didier bodin: And you're gonna find also a link before and after, if I go to it one second.
Maia Hoffman: I just want to say, while Didier is looking for this, that on the meet the fellows we use the information that you gave us. If you want to add some people sent resumes or Cvs. If you want to add edit, just please let me know, and we can make any changes that you'd like. So please feel free.
didier bodin: Okay, so while we're talking about that page on the page, meet the fellows. You will always have a Plugin giving you access to the calendar for the interviews for me on this project. And here, like Maya, said your name. Few words don't know the resume. So if you want to update these documents. Send it to us, and I'll take care of it.
didier bodin: So all of you are supposed to be there.
didier bodin: Okay, on the right side. You will have both on the portal and this page you have what we call the Fellowship Resource Library, where you have the document that and links and recommendations
didier bodin: that I've been sent either by Avi or different educators. So one like this person will be updated slowly, slowly. Under this we have
didier bodin: a lexicon page with interesting knowledge that you can have.
didier bodin: Yeah, you can access to. And you also have the latest articles that were written by Avi, and so on. So here visit that page, have a look. We always have some interesting other podcast TV interviews, articles, either quoting on from Avi himself. This is an example of how the resources pages look like we try to make it visual. So if it's an organization, we show you the Logo, the name and the direct link to the website. And you have both Israeli and Arab sources.
didier bodin: as you can see from the Uae, Qatar, Jordan, Turkey, or Arabic people present in the Us. And so on. So this change depending on the educator that is, providing these links, for example, another example from this is her links and many other interesting people, Dalia, Ziada, Hussein.
didier bodin: and so on.
didier bodin: So these pages will will appear slowly, slowly, week after week, session after session. This is an example of a session page before.
didier bodin: so like before the session, you will find an view if there is additional changes, for, like the the planning or hours you will find it there. You will always see introduction to the speaker or the educator. After the session we will provide you with a copy of the Pdf. That was used during the session, and we will insert also a copy of the recording, so everything will appear there. The idea for this portal is to be kind of to centralize
didier bodin: all the data you may need through the course. And regarding your projects. Once we will have children like each of you will have like chosen this project. Then they will also appear on the website.
didier bodin: I think we covered all the points.
Maia Hoffman: Yeah.
didier bodin: So what's important is like, visit this portal. You will always find most of the, not the data, the knowledge, the contents, that will answer most of your question in terms of knowledge and management, and if you have anything that you think would be a good idea to add in contributions, feel free to send us an email. It will be a pleasure to work with you guys.
didier bodin: So I'll give you back. I will. And then you will let Virag introduce herself.
didier bodin: There's just.
Maia Hoffman: Say one thing before that. So we have Havy Buzzo, who's gonna be a later educator. We did a different project with her. That's why haven't resources? Are there some another project? But each week
Maia Hoffman: each each educator will provide their resources, so they'll have their own page with their resources. At the end
Maia Hoffman: of the course. We'll provide you a document with all of them, and we're also building a resource library. So it will be. Also, as we build it. There'll be a page on the portal also for that. And this really came out of, you know, as Carl said, we're building the building as we move.
Maia Hoffman: We look a lot of this. What we're doing came from the conversations we had with you, and one of the things that you talked about was diversifying your sources. So we really hope that that will be a valuable that the resources provided by the speakers will be a valuable resource, valuable tool for you. Thank you. Barack.
Virag Gulyas: Okay. Hi, everyone. My name is Vira Guiesh. I'm originally from Hungary, and honestly, seeing you gives me so much hope.
Virag Gulyas: I'm not Jewish myself. I went through my own journey, you know, from anti-semitism to where I am today, and I'm a speaker and an activist for the last 10 years as a non-jew going through that journey. I'm also a director of the Speakers bureau@jnfusa. And on the side I run my own business that I help Jewish nonprofits. So this is how I ended up working also with Avi and Maya, and it's a great honor, and every time I hear Avi, such as many of you, I still learn.
Virag Gulyas: So that is very unique. I hear so many speakers, and I never have this. Okay. Every time I go I have this Aha moment that. Okay, I go out of the classroom or the lecture, and I learn something that I can, you know, build on.
Virag Gulyas: So with Avi and Maya working on social media and other things. But primarily social media Avi has his own social platform. So we are focusing on that branding. He is a geopolitical expert. When the fellowship idea came about we also created a separate account for it on Instagram, and that is the fellowship I'm sharing you here.
Virag Gulyas: so you can just quickly go and give it a like. So this is a platform that we are going to build together with you.
Virag Gulyas: because I want this platform also to be used by you. So you need to share when you are present there. If you give us a quote and I'm gonna reach out to you also when Amanda is doing the project what she mentioned before. But so this is an Instagram for the community for us, you're going to share educational bits and also highlight. You
Virag Gulyas: and I think it can serve you well as well as as a credential. You know what you can share further, that you are participating in this fellowship.
Virag Gulyas: So this is in a nutshell. I think most of you are agreeing to be highlighted on social media. If I think one person is not so, I will get the memo from Maya. So you know I'm not going to share anyone who doesn't want to be there other than that. All the information that you have provided to Maya and Avi and that are on the website probably are going to be used on social media. And whenever I find you, I also gonna tag you or call up with you in this way, you know, we can build together
Virag Gulyas: and again feel free to, you know, tag us and do more. So I hope you're gonna enjoy, you know, this time together. And yeah, that's it from me.
Maia Hoffman: And if anyone does not want, I asked all of you if it's okay to share your picture and your bio, if anyone doesn't want to please reach out to me. This should not be something that you feel you need to do. I don't anyone to feel uncomfortable, so please just feel free. You have my Whatsapp. You got my email, you got my phone. I've got everything. Just please feel free and reach out to me. If if if you if you don't want to, because we wanna make anyone feel into something that you have to do
Maia Hoffman: just like for the projects we've told you. We want to empower you to something you already want to do, and not make it an additional burden. So. And that, are there any questions, comments at this point.
Maia Hoffman: If not, I'll give you guys a couple of minutes. Break before the session starts. Anybody comments, questions.
Maia Hoffman: okay, alright.
Maia Hoffman: So so it's 2 0, 8 we want to start at 2 15. So please be back, you know, before 2 15, so we can start on time.
Maia Hoffman: I'm keeping the zoom open. Obviously.
Maia Hoffman: Alright.
Maia Hoffman: If you guys wanna I mean you're welcome to stay.
Maia Hoffman: I thought they would just turn off their cameras.
Maia Hoffman: Did they turn if they, if they turn off the cameras, do we not see them, or did that? Did they all leave? Or if they turn off the cameras, do we.
Eli Ovits: No, they're still there.
Maia Hoffman: No, they did. They just yeah. Okay. Alright.
didier bodin: Privacy, mode, candle.
Maia Hoffman: Yeah, okay, that's fine. Okay. So avi, anything you want to share, you want to give an update to the board about anything in the Middle East for a couple of minutes. Well, you should unmute yourself, you and you unmute, and I know.
Avi Melamed: Okay.
Avi Melamed: You know.
Avi Melamed: very, very shortly. Of course. Yesterday. The return of some of the hostages. The girls, of course. A very exciting moment.
Avi Melamed: Right now there has been some sort of like Mini crisis with the whole story of the release of Abe Yahuda. She's being held by the Islamic jihad.
Avi Melamed: The most recent update that I have is that hopefully it will be solved and
Avi Melamed: reportedly she will be back home hopefully even before the end of the week.
Avi Melamed: Obviously, we'll have to wait and see how it will evolve
Avi Melamed: today. Actually, the Israeli Hezbollah ceasefire came to an end.
Avi Melamed: And
Avi Melamed: What happened today in South Lebanon, the Lebanese army starting or continuing its redeployment.
Avi Melamed: and and simultaneously there is return of South Lebanese to the villages.
Avi Melamed: Now
Avi Melamed: there has been the. The Lebanese Health authority reports that there has been some more than 20 casualties during this day, arguing that those casualties are because of the firing of fidf of the of the Idf.
Avi Melamed: I don't know to say exactly what's ins and outs of this story. I've been kind of like trying to follow this.
Avi Melamed: These reports and these events have been sitting on Lebanese
Avi Melamed: broadcasting media. I've been sitting on different Arab sources trying to understand a little bit better. What's what's going on there?
Avi Melamed: And and I still don't have a clear picture of of what's the circumstances of those
Avi Melamed: incidents that has been reported? One thing is very clear.
Avi Melamed: The the Lebanese army is kind of like deploying in those places. In some places I saw oh.
Avi Melamed: videos coming, actually showing the Lebanese soldiers standing like 5 yards 5 yards from an Israeli soldiers.
Avi Melamed: Which is, of course, a very odd situation, sort of speaking, because
Avi Melamed: it's a very tense situation. It could easily result in some sort of like misunderstanding, leading to some exchange of fire. To the best of my knowledge it didn't happen yet.
Avi Melamed: and it's interesting development in 2 major aspects. One
Avi Melamed: Hezbollah, was before the end of the ceasefire. Since Israel has continued its presence in South Lebanon
Avi Melamed: and continues its military operation on the ground.
Avi Melamed: eliminating the infrastructure of Hezbollah in South Lebanon, the Hezbollah.
Avi Melamed: It recently started more and more, sending threatening messages
Avi Melamed: and saying, if that situation is going to continue post, ceasefire. Then then there is a new rules on the ground, as they say.
Avi Melamed: The the other thing, which is very interesting and significant is that this is, in a way kind of like a test for
Avi Melamed: the new Lebanese. President, Joseph Aun, who is also at the same time chief of staff
Avi Melamed: of the Lebanese Armed forces.
Avi Melamed: and Aun is clearly coming from the Lebanese Nationalist camp in the sense that he clearly rejects the Hezbollah's.
Avi Melamed: you know, taking over the State of Lebanon, he's definitely made it very clear that the army should be only in the hand of the of the State meaning Lebanon. So it's a very interesting moment of test for the for my prediction currently regarding that situation is that I think it will not. I don't think it's going to result in further escalation to the point. We'll see resume of fights
Avi Melamed: between Israel and Hezbollah, but it still has the potential to
Avi Melamed: result in some incidents and tension, so we should follow that very closely for the next couple of days.
Avi Melamed: Another, another shortly update
Avi Melamed: President trump last last night last yesterday said something about offering some sort of like evacuating Palestinians temporarily to Jordan and Egypt
Avi Melamed: to rehabilitate Gaza, strip. That statement already resulted in a lot of hustle and bustle in the Arab world, and particularly Jordan in Egypt. Jordanians rushed to formally, even though politely, say, forget about it.
Avi Melamed: It's not going to happen.
Avi Melamed: particularly Jordan, who is very sensitive with the whole issue of a Palestinian state, and so on. They are saying very clearly, Jordan is not a Palestinian state there should be a different state, a Palestinian state.
Avi Melamed: And so obviously you can understand why that statement was not warmly put it this way, warmly welcomed by the Jordanian Hashemite monarchy.
Avi Melamed: So I think that the likelihood of something like that to take place is really really slim. Egypt keeps some sort of like a silence. But you can rest sure that the Egyptians
Avi Melamed: are not excited exactly like the Jordanians of the idea of hosting even temporarily, millions of Palestinians from Gaza Strip. So all in all, I don't know to say to what extent this is something that is visible. But again, this is something that today has been in the center of discussion in the region.
Avi Melamed: that's kind of like the 2, the 2 major things that I bring today from the region. And needless to say, by the way, that Israeli right wing obviously welcomed
Avi Melamed: Trump's initiative or Trump's idea. But again, as I said, I
Avi Melamed: think and this is, I think, overarching outlook in the region. The
Avi Melamed: likelihood of the implementation of such things seems to be quite slim.
CARL CHIAPPA: I'll I'll be very.
Avi Melamed: Shortly.
CARL CHIAPPA: I'll be a very fast question. The
CARL CHIAPPA: end of the ceasefire was that a timing issue? Or was that the on the idea that Hezbollah was accusing Israel of violating the ceasefire.
Avi Melamed: Alright. So it's 2, 15 to 16. I'm muted.
Avi Melamed: Okay.
Maia Hoffman: So it is 2 16
Maia Hoffman: so I am going to hand over to Avi, and I will see you at the end to just do some some homework, and and and announcements.
Avi Melamed: One, and thank you.
Maia Hoffman: Yeah.
Avi Melamed: Thank you, Maya
Avi Melamed: Shalom Shalom, very happy and glad to be with you, looking forward to our journey together. Let me just share with you my
Avi Melamed: my presentation. I hope that you could see it clearly. Just a moment.
Avi Melamed: Can you see that? Maya? Yeah, okay, just can you? Can you click it. Yeah. Just want to make sure. Is it changing? Yes, okay.
Avi Melamed: Great Shalom Shalom, very happy and honored and pleased to be together with you, starting our journey. As I said, we are going to start a session number one. As Maya mentioned before this session today.
Avi Melamed: It's kind of like providing some sort of like an attempt to provide some sort of framing to the whole issue of the Middle East, and in the next sessions, as mentioned before, we are going to have a guest educators from the region talking about the region, and I hope that this fellowship will meet your needs and expectations
Avi Melamed: if I try to kind of like seems to be like almost impossible, but trying to provide what I would say. Key factors to understand the story of the Middle East, I would mostly mention 3 elements.
Avi Melamed: One is the geography, the other one is the diversity of the cultural, social, political, and economic identities.
Avi Melamed: And the other thing is monotheism.
Avi Melamed: Let's try a little bit elaborate on each and every one of those components starting with geography, we are looking at a region that has been constantly, historically, very significantly positioned as a land and sea bridge connecting east and and west.
Avi Melamed: More than that, this is a region that has a diversity of terrain. You're looking at an area like, for example, Mesopotamia, which is also what is known as the Levant or our days Syria and Iraq and Jordan and Israel and Palestinian territories, an area that has been actually degraded
Avi Melamed: of very 1st cultural agricultural communities and and societies. So this is one aspect of this of this terrain, the other aspect, for example, this is also a terrain that actually, because of its vastness and because of its location
Avi Melamed: kind of like, was providing an an opportunity for the emergence of a
Avi Melamed: of an urban as well as nomadic cultures that actually enriched
Avi Melamed: in many ways the the human tapestry of of this, of this, of this region.
Avi Melamed: Now you look, for example, at the area of Mesopotamia that I mentioned before. You see also to the left hand side the Nile River.
Avi Melamed: Some major ancient civilizations actually were established during those very rich, culturally and agriculturally areas. Obviously the Pharaohs in Egypt, the rebellion, the Assyrians in the area of Mesopotamia. These are ancient empires that left their mark on this region for the generations to come.
Avi Melamed: and they basically evolved in these very large, rich agricultural areas.
Avi Melamed: When we look at the manifestation of the spread of this human diversity, you see that this is a region that has been always a center for the interest of empires, empires throughout history.
Avi Melamed: Nomadic tribes that basically crossed this region, and or in course of time went through process of settling down like the Nambatis in in our times Jordan
Avi Melamed: kingdoms that used to flourish in the Arab peninsula, interesting enough in the pre-islamic time, meaning before Islam emerged in the 7th century. Islam refers to the time in an interesting term. They call it Jahiliyah. Jahiliyah is a term that has a negative context because it could be translated as an ignorance or immature.
Avi Melamed: but actually using that term trying to describe the Arab Peninsula. Pre-islam is kind of like making it wrong sort of speaking, because
Avi Melamed: before the emergence of Islam there used to be interesting, rich, powerful empires or kingdoms scattered in the Arab peninsula.
Avi Melamed: I'll give you one example. So you can understand how interesting it is in what is Yemen? Our times there used to be for a long period of time before the emergence of Islam there used to be a kingdom.
Avi Melamed: The interesting thing about that kingdom that not many people know of, that this is a kingdom that was ruled by Jews.
Avi Melamed: the king of that kingdom.
Avi Melamed: It's called the Hamyar Kingdom, basically converted to Judaism at some point, something that we refer later on, when we talk about another component that I mentioned before, and this is the significance of monotheism in the context of the Middle East. So when you look at the region. You see those huge empires.
Avi Melamed: the Persian Empire, an enormous empire.
Avi Melamed: For centuries the 2 large areas of this region in Central Asia. We will talk about this whole issue of the Persian Empire with our guest educator. When we'll try to understand the complexity of Iran's of our times definitely one of the things we'll discuss will be the whole legacy of the Persian Empire.
Avi Melamed: the Byzantine Empire. That also, basically for centuries was kind of like involved in back and forth power struggle with those empires, the Persian Empire, the Arab growing Muslim empire in the 7th century
Avi Melamed: all those empires at the same time has a significant presence in the region, marking their fingerprints on this region, and at the same time also engaged in an endless power, struggle over territory, over wealth, over hegemony, and so on.
Avi Melamed: So we are looking at this diversity, this tapestry of this region, that, to a large extent, as I said before, has to do with the significance of this region from a geostrategic geopolitical perspective.
Avi Melamed: One of the outcome of this those features is that we are looking at a region that has an enormous richness
Avi Melamed: in terms of the societies. You're looking at agricultural societies. We are looking at urban societies, nomadic societies.
Avi Melamed: It gives birth to a very rich tapestry of cultural, religious, spiritual codes and tradition. Those are very significant because these are the building block of individual as well as communal identity.
Avi Melamed: In fact, this is one of the most significant key component of
Avi Melamed: understanding the Middle East through the centuries. And particularly, I would say, in our times, and we will discuss all those issues when we'll talk about the context of identities in the Middle East in the modern time, with the emergence or the appearance of nationalism in this region.
Avi Melamed: So when you are looking at the
Avi Melamed: richness of this region, the diversity, the terrain, the the cultures, the the impact of the presence of different empire, as well as the power struggle within them. You could see how it resulted in this richness of tapestry, and then you could see how those components.
Avi Melamed: the religion. You are part of the tribe, the geography, the area you are coming from, the ethnicity that you are representing, how all those components became the core
Avi Melamed: components defining, designating designing identities as individual as communities, and later on in a larger structure.
Avi Melamed: In fact, when you look, for example, at the spread of ethnicities in the Middle East. That map shows you very clearly and very colorfully. I would say.
Avi Melamed: how rich is the tapestry. You see, the yellow and the white actually represents the Arab ethnicity.
Avi Melamed: Arab is a word, by the way, which means the men of the desert or the prairie.
Avi Melamed: The green color represents another significant group, the Turks who originated in Central Asia.
Avi Melamed: The red color that you see represents another major group in the region the Kurds particularly located in today, Iraq, Syria.
Avi Melamed: Iran in Turkey.
Avi Melamed: The orange color that you see represents the Persian ethnicity.
Avi Melamed: I know that you probably ask yourself what about the Jews? Because, as I said before, we all know Jews had a long history of presence in this region. Well, the answer is that you will have to work very hard to find where the Jewish ethnic group is located. But you could basically see that it's kind of like, roughly speaking, overlapping. If you look closer, you could see the pink.
Avi Melamed: a spot that is basically overlapping what is today the state, the state of of Israel.
Avi Melamed: I mentioned before that there are a couple of components, of identity. We talked about the geography, we talked about the diversity, and then I talked about monotes.
Avi Melamed: monotheism, the belief in one God for itself. Of course, a revolutionary idea. As you probably know, this region. Mesopotamia in this region, was the birthplace of the concept of monotheism. Starting with the mission of Abraham
Avi Melamed: mentioned in the Bible. Abraham is, is delivering the the message of monotheism, the belief in one God, and that message finally finds its path into one of those nomadic tribes in the region known as the Hebrews.
Avi Melamed: a word that has been translated mostly as
Avi Melamed: those who are passing by meaning. It basically refers to the fact that they have been some of many nomadic tribes that have dwelled in this region. So the Hebrews are actually absorbing the monotheistic belief, and later on. It's an interesting development, because later on it's going to result in the creation of a political entities.
Avi Melamed: The people of Israel that are going to establish those kingdoms mentioned in the Bible, Judea, and Samaria, which today are known also by the name of the West Bank, or the Palestinian territories, or the occupied Palestinian territories, but essentially going back. This was the cradle of the 1st
Avi Melamed: sovereign Jewish entity that was based upon the foundation of monotheistic message that was absorbed by those tribes. The Hebrews that I mentioned before.
Avi Melamed: The issue of monotheism, obviously in discussion, is described as one of the most significant milestone in the history of mankind. And rightly so, this is the time where in a pagan environment comes this revolutionary idea of monotheism.
Avi Melamed: the belief in one God and one and only one God.
Avi Melamed: It's mostly significant in the context of the Middle East, particularly when we look at the story of the Middle East under the or since the emergence of what is going to become the major religion of most people of the Middle East. And this is Islam that emerged in the 7th century in the Arab Peninsula.
Avi Melamed: When you look at the issue of monotheism in the context of
Avi Melamed: Islam and the impact on the story of the Middle East there are 2 major components that needs to be
Avi Melamed: looked at.
Avi Melamed: One is the fact that monotheism is an interesting built-in
Avi Melamed: tension between 2 major powers within
Avi Melamed: that built in within one of these one is, on the one hand, an enormous richness.
Avi Melamed: intellectually, spiritually, philosophically, ritually.
Avi Melamed: that richness stems from the fact that in the end of the day. One of the pillars of the monotheistic belief is the idea that
Avi Melamed: there is a need to translate or interpret the divine will or the divine order in a way that people could translate it into a set of norms and morals
Avi Melamed: in in customs, so that gives a wide space
Avi Melamed: for richness of of translation and interpretation
Avi Melamed: that for itself is obviously very fertilizing. It's very rich, it's very fruitful.
Avi Melamed: but at the same time there is a sense of a built-in determinism
Avi Melamed: within monotism that in the end of the day result in this power struggle between those 2 significant components.
Avi Melamed: And then there is another significant component in the context of monotheism.
Avi Melamed: particularly when we're talking again in the context of
Avi Melamed: of Islam, that became the major religion of most people in this region
Avi Melamed: since it appeared in the 7th century.
Avi Melamed: Islam views itself as a religion that has a mission.
Avi Melamed: and Islam actually views itself as the comprehensive, normative, and moral interpretation of the idea of the rule of One and one God only. Allah!
Avi Melamed: Allah! By the way, it's actually interesting. Allah was one
Avi Melamed: god of different gods and goddess
Avi Melamed: that were known in the Arab peninsula before the emergence of Islam.
Avi Melamed: So it's interesting that Islam actually
Avi Melamed: chosen that figure that that God, Allah, and basically all other gods and goddess that used to be very prevailing and known across the region in the Arab peninsula before the emergence of Islam. They basically have been
Avi Melamed: erased, so to speak, at least allegedly erased.
Avi Melamed: One of the interesting episodes in that context, something that I would like to share with you.
Avi Melamed: You may not be familiar, but maybe some of us who are a little bit older may be familiar with that. A very famous Indian author of an origin of a Muslim origin.
Avi Melamed: Wrote a book that has been called by the name of Satanic verses.
Avi Melamed: I'm not so sure that you are familiar with that book. But this is a very interesting story for itself. The author is Salman Rushdie. He wrote this book back in the seventies.
Avi Melamed: and this is a fictions book.
Avi Melamed: And following the writing of that book.
Avi Melamed: the Mullah Regime in Tehran issued a death sentence against Rushdie because of the book. It's a fictious book. It's it's wonderful book, by the way, like all of his books.
Avi Melamed: the reason they they issued that that death sentence was because Salman Rushdie allegedly in his book.
Avi Melamed: undermines or challenge the core value of Islam, the belief in one God, and one God only.
Avi Melamed: by revealing some of the inner, I would say embarrassing, or
Avi Melamed: how to bridge a contradiction that evolved within Islam. Regarding the whole story of the belief on one God.
Avi Melamed: The issue goes back to 2 sentences in the Quran. The Quran is the Holy book of the Muslims. Muslims believe that Quran was never really created. It always existed in the sky.
Avi Melamed: It's called in Arabic, and and the Quran is the words of God, of Allah.
Avi Melamed: and the core idea, of course, is there is only one God.
Avi Melamed: And sure enough, behold! In the Quran there are 2 sentences that actually
Avi Melamed: argue that there are other gods other than Allah.
Avi Melamed: which, of course, presents a very significant theological challenge to the Islamic theologians, and the way they found to mediate the challenge was to argue that those 2 sentences were put
Avi Melamed: by the Satan himself, in the mouth of Muhammad, the founder and prophet Muhammad, the founder of Islam.
Avi Melamed: However, one major core belief, as I said before, is that Islam is the comprehensive, normative, and moral interpretation of the idea of one and only one God. Allah
Avi Melamed: and Islam views itself as a religion that has a mission. Its mission is to fully materialize the rule of Allah through the establishment of a global political frame that will proactively materialize that objective by creation of what is known as the Caliphate.
Avi Melamed: This is something that is enormously significant, particularly when you look at the trajectory of the 2 other monotheistic religion, Judaism and Christianity.
Avi Melamed: Christianity was born from Judaism, and then Islam emerged couple of 100 of years later in the Arab peninsula.
Avi Melamed: When you look at the trajectory of Judaism and Christianity. During the history. You see that at some point some interesting process took place, and that is the fact that in both Judaism and Christianity, at some point there has been a separation
Avi Melamed: between the religion and between the political framework, in, in, in, in.
Avi Melamed: in both Christianity and Judaism. That process was not smooth. It involved an inner power struggle between the authorities, but in the end of the day it was decisively war.
Avi Melamed: That's not what happened in Islam. What happened in Islam was that actually
Avi Melamed: given to that outlook that see Islam as the comprehensive translation, morally and practically, of the
Avi Melamed: concept of the Word of one God.
Avi Melamed: and viewing itself as the religion that has a mission
Avi Melamed: to materialize the rule of one God of Allah, and the only one God
Avi Melamed: in Islam. What happened was that there has been no separation
Avi Melamed: between the religion and between the political frame.
Avi Melamed: It is inseparable, and this is something that is enormously significant
Avi Melamed: in the context of understanding the way it's going to impact
Avi Melamed: the trajectory of the Middle East during the history and
Avi Melamed: including in our times, of course.
Avi Melamed: So when we are going back to the early days of Islam, Islam is emerging in the Arab civilization. The 1st Muslims were Arabs.
Avi Melamed: They are coming from the Arab culture from the numeric slash tribal frame of the Arab civilization. Today. As a fact, majority of the Muslims in the world are not Arabs. They don't speak Arabic, and they are not from the Arab peninsula, but Islam roots are in the Arab culture.
Avi Melamed: so it's very early.
Avi Melamed: Features are suffocated or coming from this environment of the nomadic Arab slash
Avi Melamed: sort of like strong city centers that have been established in the Arab peninsula, like in Mecca, like in Medina, like in Yittab and other places.
Avi Melamed: talking about this whole tribal structure.
Avi Melamed: The origin of Islam, of course, goes back to its founder and its prophet, prophet Muhammad, who is coming from one tribe, the Quraysh
Avi Melamed: tribe in the Arab peninsula. That is basically part of this largest congregation that is called Banu Hashim Clan.
Avi Melamed: This is the place where Muhammad is coming from. From that specific tribal frame, a very powerful one, that has different families, and most of its wealth or significant part of its wealth is done through trade
Avi Melamed: as they have been training across the region. That is very significant, among other things, because of the fact that most scholars tend to assume that Muhammad's prophecy was to a large extent also influenced by his encounter with both Christians and Jews in his travels across the region as a merchant.
Avi Melamed: Muhammad is founding Islam. What is going to become the Islam Empire? And, by the way, in the beginning Islam was under the run
Avi Melamed: because the powerful centers of the Arab peninsula viewed Muhammad and his prophecy as a source of a threat.
Avi Melamed: One of the major reason was because they were basically pagans.
Avi Melamed: And here comes Muhammad with his delivering of the idea of one God and one God only.
Avi Melamed: And not only that the 1st prophecies Muhammad is doing are
Avi Melamed: fully centers around the concept of the end of Days and Judgment Day. Those are things that have been very disturbing for the rich, powerful players in the Arab peninsula, and there was a very strong opposition
Avi Melamed: to to Muhammad and his prophecy. In fact.
Avi Melamed: that was also the stage for the emergence of a a concept that you probably are familiar with or heard for the concept of jihad.
Avi Melamed: We will, of course, talk about it in a contemporary context later on, with one of our guest educators.
Avi Melamed: But jihad! In its very early days the word jihad actually means an enormous effort.
Avi Melamed: and mostly it refers to a spiritual effort. It refers actually to the very early day of Islam, when Islam was under the run.
Avi Melamed: At 1st to the point, Muhammad and his 1st followers had to flee from Mecca Muhammad's birthplace to Medina.
Avi Melamed: another major center in the Arab peninsula, and so during those years the concept of jihad was mostly centers around the devotion of the early believers in Islam.
Avi Melamed: and the willingness to sacrifice emotionally and spiritually for their faith.
Avi Melamed: And, by the way, there was an interesting episode where Mohammed in his early days was trying to recruit
Avi Melamed: some rich Jewish tribes in the Arab peninsula. He was trying basically to make them join his religion, Islam, and they rejected it. Interesting enough. One of the things that Muhammad was doing as part of his marketing effort was to say to the Jews that the 1st pray direction, pray of Muslims will be Al-quds.
Avi Melamed: or, as you probably know it in other name, Jerusalem.
Avi Melamed: Knowing that Jerusalem is the holiest centers of the Jews. Muhammad basically calculated that that could be a good hook to capture the Jews and to make them join him. It didn't happen, but interesting enough in the 1st couple of months of Islam.
Avi Melamed: Jerusalem Al-quds was the direction of the pray. That's the reason why Jerusalem is known in Arabic, by the name of which means the 1st one chronologically, for the direction of pray, and the 3rd one in terms of holiness.
Avi Melamed: After Mecca and Medina, the 2 other separate sides of Israel.
Avi Melamed: Just the shame! It's just the same. Muhammad has been successfully able to create coalitions and to expand its influence across the Arab peninsula, and so when he dies in in the year 632, his followers, you know, going to be known by the name of caliphs.
Avi Melamed: terms that actually mean the placeholder of Rasulullah, of the Prophet of Allah, namely, Hamad, are going to expand geographically and politically, the influence of Islam across across the region. So we are looking at a chain of 4th caliph
Avi Melamed: that follows Muhammad. They are also known as the Righteousness Caliph.
Avi Melamed: and the interesting thing, among other things, is that they were not necessarily. They are not part of Muhammad's bloodline.
Avi Melamed: In fact, the 1st Alifa Abu Bakril Sadiq was a good friend, but he was not
Avi Melamed: related to Muhammad through a bloodline. This is a very significant point. Shortly we'll understand. Why is that
Avi Melamed: we reach at some point to the 4th Caliph Ali bin Abi Talib.
Avi Melamed: who was the cousin and and son-in-law of Prophet Muhammad. He was married to Muhammad's daughter Fatma.
Avi Melamed: This is also the period of time where Islam, that is, in the growth and expanding, is also starting to experience inner challenges and power struggles that are going to deepen
Avi Melamed: within its ranks and going to echo through the centuries to very days of our time.
Avi Melamed: So that map shows you the early days of the expansion of the Muslim Empire. You see the dark brown shows you the days of Muhammad and the expansion. Mostly you could see it's in the Arab peninsula where Muhammad was able to set off both military raids and coalitions. Very cleverly sold. He was a very shrewd politician as well as military leader.
Avi Melamed: He was able to expand the prophecy or the action or the mission of Islam in the Arab peninsula, and in the times of the followers. The 4th righteousness caliphs. You could see the orange color showing you Islam is significantly expanding, and one of the most significant thing to notice is that now Islam in that time
Avi Melamed: is decisively winning an ancient power struggle with one of the major
Avi Melamed: civilization in the region. And this is the Persian civilization.
Avi Melamed: What happened in the areas that has been becoming part of this Muslim Caliphate is that most of the people in those areas basically converted to Islam. They adopted the concept of Islam. They became Muslims in their belief, however, some continue
Avi Melamed: to keep their own religious identity. Like Christians like Jews, if not less significant, they kept their
Avi Melamed: ethnical components at ethnical identity.
Avi Melamed: In other words, the nations or the people that join. Now the growing Islamic empire were no longer Arabs. The meaning of that is that in sense of demography we are now looking at the expansion of the Muslim Empire, originated in the Arab peninsula, but
Avi Melamed: more and more people are joining in. They become Muslims in the religion, but they are
Avi Melamed: different in their ethnicities.
Avi Melamed: The concept of the Caliphate
Avi Melamed: is is a materialization of the concept of the rule of one in one God only. Allah.
Avi Melamed: and the expansion of Islam very quickly results in a significant power struggle in Islam that resonates to our times and our days. And this is the power struggle between Sunnis and Shia.
Avi Melamed: This power struggle actually start and goes back to the very early days of the tribal system. The structure
Avi Melamed: of the Arab society in the Arab peninsula the same tribal system that gave birth to Islam. As I said before.
Avi Melamed: and in the center of that there is a power struggle between 2 major
Avi Melamed: tribes or 2 major families or structure of families within the Arab peninsula. One is the Benni Hashem family, from which, as I mentioned before, prophet Muhammad refers to the other. One is called Banu Abdel Shams, and one of its most significant.
Avi Melamed: powerful, economically, politically and militarily component. The Umayye family.
Avi Melamed: When we reach to the time of the 4th Caliph Ali bin Abi Talib Islam is expanding. As I showed you in the map, Ali bin Abi Talib, the 4th caliph married to Muhammad's daughter Fatma.
Avi Melamed: and they have together 4 kids, 2 boys, and 2 girls.
Avi Melamed: When Ali is assassinated. His older son, Hassan, who is also the direct grandson of in line of prophet Muhammad. He claims the crown of Caliphate to himself, and he becomes for a short period of time the Caliph.
Avi Melamed: but yet again facing an increasing opposition
Avi Melamed: both within the camps of power centers in Arab Peninsula, as well as within those families that, as I mentioned before, particularly the Umayye family that actually claimed the crown of leadership for themselves. So after a short period of time, Hasan is actually stepping down. Later on, he's going to be assassinated as well, and his brother Hussein
Avi Melamed: is claiming the crown of leadership, he argues, my brother was caliph, my father was Ali, and I am a grandson of Prophet Muhammad himself, therefore I'm entitled to have the crown of the leadership at this point. The power struggle within Islam is no longer reachable sort of speaking, because it is in essence a power struggle over the leadership of this expanding.
Avi Melamed: enlarging, and significantly growing politically and economically structure of the Caliphate as we saw
Avi Melamed: that power struggle ended up inevitably in a major collision.
Avi Melamed: In fact, there were a couple of collisions, and the significant one is happening in the year 680, in a place called Kerbela. This is Iraq of our time.
Avi Melamed: In this battle Hussein bin Ali bin Abi Talib. In fact, the last grandson, by bloodline of Prophet Muhammad and his followers, are butchered
Avi Melamed: in this. In this, in this battleground.
Avi Melamed: you know one of the interesting thing about history, about this region and maybe about history in general.
Avi Melamed: is that sometimes you see that history is very much present.
Avi Melamed: and I'll give you an example in the context of that specific story. And then another interesting example.
Avi Melamed: During the last year, as you probably know, there has been a war between Israel and Hezbollah in South Lebanon, and at some point a friend of mine, who.
Avi Melamed: serving as a in the Idf. Senior rank position, he called me, and he was the headquarter in South Lebanon, and he said, Look, we came across something very interesting. We don't know exactly what is that? And I was like what. And he was, we say we saw these flags and logos and signs of
Avi Melamed: some unit of the his. Bolarity is called the 3 1, 3 Unit.
Avi Melamed: And I was like, oh, that's very interesting. That's very interesting.
Avi Melamed: 3, 1, 3 unit. His name is actually named after the number of the followers who fight on
Avi Melamed: Ali and Hossein bin Ali Camp, in the year 680.
Avi Melamed: They were all butchered
Avi Melamed: by his opponents. Yazid bin Muawiyah was the head of the military power of the Muawiyah family, and later on is going to become the Caliph himself. His father. Back then was the caliph.
Avi Melamed: And so you see how across history those things continue to to resonate. In other words.
Avi Melamed: this is a formative time of the inner split within Islam, between Sunnis and Shia.
Avi Melamed: the full term Shiat Ali, the political disciples of political faction, or followers of Ali bin Abi Talib, the 4th Caliph.
Avi Melamed: and the figure of Hussein bin Ali.
Avi Melamed: who was butchered in this battle in Kerbala, in 680, became a formative figure within the Shia, I believe.
Avi Melamed: and he has been, among other things, and shortly. We'll say a few words about it, described as the lord of martyrs.
Avi Melamed: Sayyed Shuhada in in Arabic.
Avi Melamed: in Shia. It believes that will say a few words about it shortly. The concept of this martyrdom is enormously embedded.
Avi Melamed: and it's very powerful narrative in the Shiite
Avi Melamed: narrative, politically, culturally, historically, and so on.
Avi Melamed: And
Avi Melamed: One of the slogans of the Shiite is actually saying, every day is Ashua, and every place is Karbala. Karbela is the place where the battle took place. What is Ashua?
Avi Melamed: Ashua is the 10th day of the month, the Muslim month of Muharram. This is the day where the barrel took place, and it's interesting enough that the word Ashua
Avi Melamed: means 10, and it comes from Aramaic and Hebrew. The word is Essil.
Avi Melamed: and it was then changed into Ashua. But it's the same origin. The 10th day of this month.
Avi Melamed: the months of Muharram were highly
Avi Melamed: when Hossein ben Ali and his followers are butchered in the battle in in Kiribana.
Avi Melamed: But you could see, for example, statements of current days, Shi'ite leaders, like, for example, the late leader of Hezbollah Hassan Masalah, who was talking more than once about this issue of every day is Ashua. In every place is Kerbilah. It's kind of like an endless continuing
Avi Melamed: a moment of agony
Avi Melamed: and suffer in the story of of the Shiites. I saw, for example, videos of Shiite preachers in mosques that are performing
Avi Melamed: the day of Ashura, and it's interesting to see how this whole ceremony becomes a static situation. Ecstatic situation, where people are, literally speaking, are going through this phase of
Avi Melamed: emotionally identification and solidarity to the point that it becomes ecstatic.
Avi Melamed: One of the well-known ceremonies that is associated with that you probably are familiar with. That is what is known as tazia, which means torturing, self-torturing. You could see every year. There are some places in the Shia communities where men's are walking down the street, and they are beating themselves with knives and swords, and cutting themselves as
Avi Melamed: identification with the suffering and death of Hosain ben Ali in 680.
Avi Melamed: By the way, there has been another interesting phenomenon called Tatbil. When on that day you could see people standing Shiite in the entrance of Shiite shrines, and actually also conducting those ceremonies to the point that current Shiite spiritual clergy renounce that phenomenon or that
Avi Melamed: expression of self torturement, and and actually ask to to stop that.
Avi Melamed: We talked about how things are echoing over time. And here is something that I want to share with you in that regards. In context of the Shiite in our times. What you see is one of many interesting posters published by the Iranian regime in our Times.
Avi Melamed: and that poster was published following the elimination of the Iranian general, Qasem Soleimani, who was the commander of Al-qud's force.
Avi Melamed: the spearhead of the Islamic revolutionary guards. This is the core, the power that is responsible for the expansion of what is known as the Islamic Revolution.
Avi Melamed: and this is one of many different posters published, and that that
Avi Melamed: poster that you see in front of you emphasize, of course, the idea that Soleimani is is a martyr is now in heaven, and he's being
Avi Melamed: embraced by no other than than the Lord of materials himself.
Avi Melamed: Hussein Ben Ali. Notice how the figures are different in their size and dimensions. Of course, obviously Hussein bin Ali is portrayed in a much larger
Avi Melamed: dimensions. And and you can understand why and by the way, this is something that repeats itself in different
Avi Melamed: forms in in current days Iranian Shia propaganda, very interesting for itself to understand the historical context
Avi Melamed: of of those of those posters as we did right now.
Avi Melamed: a few words about the core values of the Shi'ite. The Shia believes the major branch of the Shia is known as the 12 Ish believes there has been line of 12 spiritual leaders. They call them, Imam, starting with the full Caliph Ali bin Abi Talib, and they believe that the last one of them.
Avi Melamed: Muhammad bin el Hassan Al-askari, lived in the 9th century and disappeared. They believe he's not dead. They believe he's waiting outside of time and history to be summoned up and come and lead mankind to salvation as the Mahdi. If you wish the Messiah.
Avi Melamed: The interesting thing in that regard is that the according to the Shia, I believe the Imams are
Avi Melamed: are connected directly to a divine source of knowledge, therefore they are immune from mistakes. This is something that has been echoed very strongly in current times. Mullah regime in Tehran, because the that
Avi Melamed: outlook resulted in a political translation in the sense of what is called meaning the absolute rule of the the the religious jurispondent meaning the man that is on top of this whole system. The
Avi Melamed: the religious Joe respondent is actually immune from mistakes because he is
Avi Melamed: connected to a divine source of knowledge, and therefore his rule is absolute, and he has to be blindly obeyed, which is very significant. In current times. Mullah regime in Tehran. Again. We'll talk much more in length about Iran of our days with one of our guest educators.
Avi Melamed: To sum up sharply the the differences between Sunnis and Shiite. By the way, Sunnau means the path Sunna Tel Nabi, the path of the of the Prophet.
Avi Melamed: and, as I said before, majority of the Muslims in the world. About 84% are Sunnis. The Shiites are minorities about 14%. And here you see in front of you that sums up the major differences between Shiite and Sunnis the Shiite are talking about the rule of leading the legitimacy of ruling the Muslim world is through a bloodline. Of course we talked about the line of the Imam starting with the 4th Caliph
Avi Melamed: Ali bin Abi Talib, the Sunnis are saying, it's not about bloodline. It's about a person that will be elected to his position.
Avi Melamed: based upon skills and capacities.
Avi Melamed: The Shiites talks about the issue of the Imam as a source of is the ultimate rule that is, is immune from any criticism.
Avi Melamed: The Sunnas are basically saying, no. The leader of this Caliphate or the Muslim entity has to be constantly criticized for his decisions and actions, and he can be out if he's not fulfilling his duties as required. The Shias are basically saying, we know
Avi Melamed: the name and features and facial features of the Mahdi, the Messiah to come.
Avi Melamed: The Sunni says it is unknown.
Avi Melamed: while the Shiite emphasizes the concept of the rule of the Faqi. The religious respondent is something that has to be blindly obeyed. The Sunnas are basically saying, not at all, not at all. A man is a man, and he is immune from. He's not immune from mistakes, and he has to be constantly under correction and under criticism.
Avi Melamed: Another significant thing is that the Shia is saying that
Avi Melamed: the comprehensive system of Islam is not only the Quran, obviously the Quran is the word of Allah himself, and obviously this is the pillar. But they are saying also that
Avi Melamed: the combination of the Quran.
Avi Melamed: together with the chain of Imams and the concept of Mahdi, these are the things that in the end of the day represents the full comprehensive system of Islam as it should be.
Avi Melamed: This is something that the Sunnis obviously are rejecting totally. They're basically saying.
Avi Melamed: it's not, it's not acceptable. You cannot put
Avi Melamed: a man in the same level of of significance or influence or importance with the Quran. The Quran is the words of Allah himself. Therefore it, if you are kind of like even thinking about combining something else to Quran, is equal in sense of importance. So here you see some of the major differences between Sunnis and Shiites.
Avi Melamed: However, when you look at the course of history following that period of time, that very stormy period of time, the 7th century in Islam. You see that in the end of the day
Avi Melamed: the Arab dynasties are actually the one that are taking the lead, continuing to take the lead. The sunnahs are becoming the dominant power within Islam. In parallel to that. What we see is the expansion
Avi Melamed: of Islam, the further expansion of Islam. Now we are looking at the time of the Umayyad Caliphate. Remember the Umayyads. The dynasty is the one that actually crushed the Shiite rebel, and ever since then, by the way.
Avi Melamed: they are being cursed by the Iranians. In fact, the Iranian constitution of our times is cursing some of those figures because of their role in the killing of Hosain ben Ali.
Avi Melamed: However, the Umayyad Caliphate expand. It didn't last relatively long. About 100 years. For different reasons it comes to an end, and then a major expansion of the Muslim empire takes place under the rule of the Abbasid.
Avi Melamed: a dynasty who is going to rule this large area, this Caliphate, for 500 years until it's going to be crushed down by the Mongolian invasion. One of the things. By the way, interesting enough is that in the discussion in the Muslim world, and not only the Muslim world, also within Western scholars trying to explain the downfall of the Muslim civilization, once
Avi Melamed: an outstanding civilization that gave men so many achievements.
Avi Melamed: There is an ongoing discussion within the Muslim world, and Western scholars regarding the question, what has led to this agonizing downfall
Avi Melamed: of what used to be an enormous achieving civilization? Some Muslim scholars argue that the major reason, if not the only one is the invasion of the Mongols. That ended the reign of the Abbasi Caliphate that ruled this region for 500 years. Obviously, as you could understand. There are many scholars who
Avi Melamed: totally do not agree to that, and I personally think that it is correct. You cannot attribute something like that only to one factor we are looking at, I would say, combination of different factors
Avi Melamed: in that regard. I will clearly recommend to read this book, written by very, very famous
Avi Melamed: a Middle Eastern expert, Professor Bernard Lewis.
Avi Melamed: In one of his book. It's called What Went wrong. He actually tried to explain
Avi Melamed: the different reasons for the different explanations brought to explain the downfall of the Muslim civilization, and he himself provide, I would say, some very interesting perspectives which I think, are very relevant to as a sort of an explanation. I would not
Avi Melamed: share it with you. I will leave you to read that book. It's not a very thick book, and it's, I would say, friendly reader, friendly, and I strongly and warmly recommend reading that book in that regard.
Avi Melamed: So we are looking at this
Avi Melamed: region, we mentioned before this different civilizations, we mentioned the Arab civilization, the Persian civilization. By the way, when 1st the Arab civilization is conquering during the 1st period of expansion of Islam, the time of the
Avi Melamed: false righteousness, Caliphate following Muhammad. They are also conquering the Persian civilization, an ancient rivalry of Dhara civilization, and at 1st the Persian civilization
Avi Melamed: converted to Sunni Islam. But later on the Middle Ages it's basically for different reasons, changed from the Sunni denomination into the Shiite one. And actually, today a majority of the Persians are Shiites in their in their denomination. And then we, we say, the Turks we mentioned earlier. The Turks.
Avi Melamed: the Turks are actually going to appear in the stage of this region, and are going to be an enormously significant player in the story of the Middle East. Starting back there in the 13th century, when the tribes that are coming from Central Asia, the Turks actually are kind of like starting their expansion across the region.
Avi Melamed: which going to result in the establishing of what's going to be known by the name of the Turkish Ottoman Empire.
Avi Melamed: the Turkish Ottoman Empire that is going to rule the Middle East for 600 years.
Avi Melamed: until the early days of the 20th century, until the end of the 1st World War.
Avi Melamed: the Turkish Empire. Actually the Turkish Ottoman Empire is actually the biggest and longest Islamic frame
Avi Melamed: that ruled, since, of course, the emergence of Islam
Avi Melamed: under the Turkish Ottoman Empire. Basically, what we saw was that all the components of this region basically were merged into a 1, but not necessarily cohesive
Avi Melamed: and smoothly comprehensive system.
Avi Melamed: So you got the tapestry of those
Avi Melamed: cultures, political powers, diversity of languages, diversity of populations.
Avi Melamed: the enormous size, geographically speaking, of that Empire in the end of the day. What we see was that it kind of like was
Avi Melamed: absorbing
Avi Melamed: all those different groups in a larger scale, even in comparison to the previous expansion of the Muslim Caliphates during the Umayyad and the Abbasid times.
Avi Melamed: and to the point, some scholars and historians argue that in the end of the day the downfall of the Turkish Ottoman Empire was already built in due the fact that it was absorbing this huge amount of nations, tapestry of cultures and identities and the size of this Empire.
Avi Melamed: However, it should be emphasized that at least for the 1st couple of hundreds of his existence, the Turkish Ottoman Empire was an enormously powerful and enormously structured and enormously stable
Avi Melamed: empire to the point. It actually presented a very significant tangible threat to the Christian
Avi Melamed: civilization, manifested, of course, in the most famous episode of the Turkish Ottoman Empire powers that reached the gates of the city of Vienna, where basically they have been blocked. However, one way or another, we are looking at a major empire, that its legacy on the region
Avi Melamed: it varies. But the most significant issue in the context of our program. And basically, it's kind of like a segue to our upcoming session with our
Avi Melamed: guest educator
Avi Melamed: and results mostly. Or, I would say, mostly relevant in the context of identity in the 20th century, when we are going to see for the 1st time actually.
Avi Melamed: the emergence of a frame in the Middle East that is known by the name of national state.
Avi Melamed: a phrase or a frame that actually did not exist.
Avi Melamed: As you probably know the whole idea of nationalism actually emerged earlier in the 19th century. In other areas, some of them, by the way, areas controlled by the Turks, like the Balkans, for example.
Avi Melamed: And then it was translated and transformed into the Middle East itself, and in the 20th century we are entering a new phase a new dramatic and significant phase in the story of the Middle East, and this is the introduction of the people of the Middle East to the concept of national statehood
Avi Melamed: end the huge ramifications of that turn or that chapter in the shaping of the Middle East
Avi Melamed: of our times.
Avi Melamed: and that will be the subject that we'll discuss in our next chapter with our guest Educator.
Avi Melamed: So here I'm ending the opening session
Avi Melamed: and opening this session to your questions.
Aliya Zigman: What was the name of the book? Again.
Avi Melamed: Let me try to bring it from a different perspective.
Avi Melamed: Was there a specific component in my presentation? That was something that you have never heard of, and kind of like you found it to be very.
CARL CHIAPPA: They.
Avi Melamed: Interesting in the context of understanding the region.
CARL CHIAPPA: Avi, I think
CARL CHIAPPA: I think.
CARL CHIAPPA: Wait a minute.
Avi Melamed: Cannot hear the question.
CARL CHIAPPA: Yeah, it's because we're muted.
Avi Melamed: Wait, are you? You're cause you're wait.
Avi Melamed: Yup! Yup, on mute.
Avi Melamed: Sorry I was on mute.
Avi Melamed: Okay, now I think that I can hear you.
beth goldsmith: The question actually was, what the name of the book was that you had recommended? That was first, st and then Carl was coming in to say that you're not hearing us.
Avi Melamed: Yeah. So I'm sorry.
beth goldsmith: So you weren't hearing the fellows question that.
Avi Melamed: Yeah, I'm sorry I'm sorry. So the name of the book was what went wrong.
Avi Melamed: It's written by Bernard Lewis, a very well-known famous historian
Avi Melamed: of the Middle East and and and Asia.
Avi Melamed: I personally had the the honor of meeting with him couple of times in an interesting sessions. He used to
Avi Melamed: used to come to Israel as a very close friend of the legendary Mayor of Jerusalem, Teddy Kolek
Avi Melamed: With whom I had the honor to work, and there used to be an interesting meetings
Avi Melamed: once or twice a year with Professor Lewis. That was kind of like a closed session with some leaders, Arab leaders, and Israeli Jewish leaders.
Avi Melamed: and Professor Lewis was providing a
Avi Melamed: something similar to what I did. But in the context of like current update of the Middle East Jew strategic perspectives. And and he was a British
Avi Melamed: and the combination of his knowledge and the British accent, as you can understand, was very powerful, resulting in more than once very heated debate between him and the guests.
Avi Melamed: And who were kind of like very strongly opposing his perspective. In any case, definitely I would strongly recommend to read that book and other things that he published as well.
Avi Melamed: So other questions. I'm sorry I didn't hear, so please repeat the question so I could refill.
Brooklyn Tory: I was wondering how much influence did the Mongol invasion have in changes between the Abbasid Caliphate and the shift to the Ottoman Empire?
Avi Melamed: Well, it's interesting, because, as I said before, some Arab, some Muslims and Western scholars, particularly Muslim scholars, attribute the downfall of the Abbasi, and then the downfall of the later on this Muslim civilization to that invasion of the Mongols.
Avi Melamed: But in the end of the day, as I said before, I don't think that that is a major region reason it could be one of the reasons. As for in the context of the relationship with the Turks, the common denominator is in the fact that they are basically came from a
Avi Melamed: the same geographical, roughly speaking, area. Central Asia came coming from the nomadic tribe. Nomadic tribe system. One of the interesting, you know, some of you guys are involved in, you know, while studying history, and always in the study of history, there is
Avi Melamed: component, or those who are basically emphasizing the components of specific issues that seems to be not so meaningful. But they are very meaningful. And in the context of the Mongol invasion and the way that they have been crushing the Abbasid Empire. One explanation that I came across was that the Mongols were excelling in the use of arrows
Avi Melamed: while riding horses.
Avi Melamed: which was very interesting for me as an interesting explanation for the military achievements. I don't know. To say if that is exactly explaining that it's exactly like other explanations that refer to other episodes in history.
Avi Melamed: Like, for example, the structure of the phalanx in early Greek history. Just the same. I don't know to say to what extent the Mongol invasion was significant in the impact or the fingerprints in the context of the following Turkish Ottoman Empire.
Avi Melamed: because, relatively speaking, there has not been a significant gap in times between the one and the other, roughly speaking, about 50 years, by the way, most of the Mongols converted to Islam.
Avi Melamed: and they have became yet yet another part of this largely growing empire that absorbed into that more and more people coming from different
Avi Melamed: cultural, ethnic, traditional, and geographic areas. The Mongols were one of them, but I don't. To the best of my knowledge, I don't think that they had a significant impact in the context of the structure of the Turkish Ottoman Empire that follows the invasion. You've got Miranda, then, Ori. Then Ben
Avi Melamed: Miranda.
Miranda Ruzinsky: Oh, I have 2 questions. I'm just going to pick one is so I feel like one of the common themes throughout the history of this region that you were talking about is this concept of a national or unifying narrative, whether it's an ethnic, unifying something that people can gather around, and I was wondering, is there right now in the Middle East? Is there a conversation about the power of a national, unifying narrative and its impact on the current state of the Middle East.
Avi Melamed: Definitely. This is one of the most significant discussion that, as I mentioned before, when we enter the 20th century, and the whole issue of nationalism now was adding to this whole mixture of ethnicity, religion, geographic area, tradition, customs. Now you've got the component of nationalism joining in. Obviously, you could understand that the
Avi Melamed: discussion became more multilayered, more more heated and more complex.
Avi Melamed: And and indeed, in in the next session. And when we'll talk about this component of identity in the 20th century Middle East. In the context of national statehood.
Avi Melamed: that will be one of the major issues that we will discuss just as a very relevant example of right now our days, as we are talking
Avi Melamed: in Arab States like Lebanon cereal, Iraq.
Avi Melamed: Right now, what we are witnessing is that the boosting of Nationalist camp
Avi Melamed: in those areas that actually emphasizes the centrality of the entity that is called the State
Avi Melamed: is a is a unifying common denominator.
Avi Melamed: It's not new, it's been there.
Avi Melamed: it's strengthened. And the component that is still you can find it all along the way is that it continues to result in this.
Avi Melamed: this inner debate regarding the features of identity.
Avi Melamed: I'll give you an example from today today, literally speaking.
Avi Melamed: I don't know if you heard it. But when you went out for break and came back I was talking a little bit short update, and I was talking about.
Avi Melamed: And the fact that today or actually yesterday.
Avi Melamed: No. Today, actually, the Israeli Hezbollah ceasefire in South Lebanon came to an end.
Avi Melamed: and South Lebanese people who flee from the region, started to go back to the villages and towns in South Liban.
Avi Melamed: and I've been following reports coming in, and I saw something which refers very well to what what you ask right now, Miranda.
Avi Melamed: a Lebanese guy from South Lebanon, basically posted a video.
Avi Melamed: And speaking, of course, in in Arabic, in Lebanese accent.
Avi Melamed: By the way, there are different
Avi Melamed: dialect of Arabic. I'm familiar with some of them. The Lebanese is is very interesting. It's very
Avi Melamed: kind of like rich and artistic in a way.
Avi Melamed: And and so I like to listen to those people who are making, you know, videos talking. And so there was this guy today South Lebanese. He was really pissed. He was really angry. And the reason he was angry. He said, he said, I don't get it, he said, so people are going back today, his brothers, the Lebanese, going back to South Lebanon. I didn't say, he said. I didn't see one single Lebanese flag.
Avi Melamed: I saw that they were waving the flag of Iran, the flag of Hezbollah, and he was really pissed, and he said.
Avi Melamed: We are Lebanese. We have a flag the flag of Lebanon.
Avi Melamed: So that episode, really, I think, reflect, or you know, refers to the question that you you ask
Avi Melamed: definitely. I mean one of the most fascinating thing to follow in this region through the 20th century and our days
Avi Melamed: is the whole issue of nationalism and and its place in the
Avi Melamed: I would say, the identity, fabric, and tapestry of the people in the region.
Avi Melamed: and that, of course, as I said, that will be discussed in our next session with our guest educator so Ori Ben, then Isaac Ori.
Ori Josell: So you were talking about.
Ori Josell: I I think I didn't quite understand it completely.
Ori Josell: The impact of
Ori Josell: like the Ottoman Empire on the rise of nationalism in the in the regions that it occupied. Could you sort of elaborate on that.
Avi Melamed: Yes.
Ori Josell: To to connect it to what Miranda just asked.
Avi Melamed: Yes, well again, during the time of the Turkish Ottoman Empire. None of those what we know today as states like in the region Saudi, Arabia, Egypt, Jordan. They did not exist
Avi Melamed: because it was one large entity, the the empire, the Sultanate, the Sultan
Avi Melamed: in Turkey, was the highest source of authority, the the ruler of this whole empire. So there was no
Avi Melamed: political independent entities in this region. Interesting, for example.
Avi Melamed: today, in the discussion, when you talk about Syria, for example. Now, as you probably know, following the downfall of Assad rule in Syria, there is the new rulers in Syria, or Major Chunk, or major pillar of this new rule in Syria is an umbrella of Islamic affiliated groups that is known by the name of hts.
Avi Melamed: The authority for the liberation of sham. What is that sham
Avi Melamed: sham is a term in Arabic that has been
Avi Melamed: common for centuries, and basically describing a geographical region
Avi Melamed: during the time of the Turkish Ottoman Empire, which is today in our times. Obviously, once there is no more Turkish Ottoman Empire, and instead, you got the emergence of national statehood in the Middle East. That region sham is today the region that includes
Avi Melamed: States.
Avi Melamed: Syria, Jordan, Israel, the Palestinian territories. There are even those who include Cyprus as part of Isham. But it's interesting to see how that term today basically mostly refers in the context of Syria. So the reason I'm saying that is because, as I said before, during the Turkish Ottoman period, there is no frame of semi or state entities.
Avi Melamed: A major exception, I would say, in that regard is Egypt.
Avi Melamed: that already back in the second part of the 19th century, already became to a large extent some sort of like an independent separatist entity, yet still formerly part of this Turkish Ottoman Empire, and also, to a certain extent, another entity that existed in the northern part of Yemen.
Avi Melamed: a sort of like a Shiite kingdom, a Yemenite, one that that was existing in the northern part of Yemen, but still formerly was part of the Turkish Ottoman Empire.
Avi Melamed: So during the rule of the Turks, the Turkish Ottoman Empire, until the emergence of nationalism in Europe and in the center in the middle of the 19th century, the 1,800, and then the percolation of that sentiment into the region.
Avi Melamed: The concept of nationalism did not exist. It didn't exist, particularly
Avi Melamed: in the sense that for the common people it was totally something unknown.
Avi Melamed: It has been transformed or or introduced to the region, mostly by the intellectual elites
Avi Melamed: in the region. By the way, many of those were Christians in their religion who were very excited about this whole notion of nationalism, and it was introduced to the people of the region towards the the last 3rd of the 1,800.
Avi Melamed: But during the Turkish period of time, until the downfall, actually the Turkish Ottoman Empire, the concept of nationalism did not materialized yet
Avi Melamed: into the structure of states, as we see today in the region.
Avi Melamed: Ben, and then so Ben and Isaac, and then we'll wrap it up because it's we have 5 min left. We want to be respectful.
Ben Monroe: I'm curious about how a Middle Eastern country's nationality affects its relationships with other Middle Eastern countries. So, for instance, Iran and Armenia are very closely linked because their ethnographic ties versus Iran and Azerbaijan, which are enemies, even though they have a shared religion in Shiite Islam.
Ben Monroe: So I'm curious. What's more important to a Middle Eastern's nationality. Is it ethnographic ties, or is it shared religion.
Avi Melamed: Well, Ben, it's a question that has many, many layers. Of course you mentioned a couple of them. For example, you talked about
Avi Melamed: ethnicity. On the one hand, religious, on the other hand, which, by the way, is part of this very complex tapestry. In other words, what you have presented very accurately, is actually hinting to something very interesting about this region, and that is the fact that
Avi Melamed: you could or should expect that. You see, you know, alliance or factors that are coming from the same Campe, Sunni, Sunni, Shiite, Shiite, you know, same ethnicity that are basically sharing the same, the same
Avi Melamed: common denominators. You would expect that necessarily or inevitably they will kind of like form an alliances. That's not necessarily the case. Many times in the story of the Middle East, let alone. When you are talking about
Avi Melamed: ideologies.
Avi Melamed: I'll give you an example. You gave a good example. By the way, talking about the Iranians, Iran and Armenia
Avi Melamed: and the Armenians Christians, I mean they are in a power struggle. For a long period of time you talked about Azerbaijan, and the violent power struggle between these 2 entities there are Azerbaijan, supported by Turkey Armenians, supported by the Iranians. These are Shiites. These are Christians in Azerbaijan. You got Shiites, and Turkey, is a Sunni. So you see here a great example of
Avi Melamed: the what expected to be as a common denominator, meaning the sense that you are, whether you share the same religious or the same ethnicity is not necessarily a guarantee that you will find the alliances. In fact, you could find
Avi Melamed: a power struggle between between those different camps. Then you got the issue of an ideology, and I'll just give a short example, maybe, which would bring it at some point in our discussion. Back then, in the in the days of Yemen, in the sixties, when there was a war, a civil, brutal war in Yemen,
Avi Melamed: the the monarchies Saudi, Arabia and Jordan basically supported the the elements of the monarchies or Muslim brotherhood in in Yemen.
Avi Melamed: Egypt. Back then, that time, under the leadership of Abdel Nasser was basically supporting the anti-monarchy powers in Yemen. And so it was always an interesting mixture of you could not necessarily expect what seems to be like naturally to be expected, and there are many examples for that in the history or the story of the Middle East.
Avi Melamed: Last question, Isaac.
Isaac Babus: So the Islamic regime of Iran has managed to kind of create this larger empire via
Isaac Babus: all the the land bridge through Lebanon and Syria which has changed, but
Isaac Babus: I feel like I haven't seen Sunni
Isaac Babus: countries do anything similar aside from I guess, Turkey, but they haven't created as much of a unifying structure. Do you think there's a reason why.
Avi Melamed: Well, I mean, we'll probably have the opportunity to elaborate on those expansionist regimes or powers. You mentioned the Mullah regime in Iran. We also mentioned Turkey, particularly under the leadership of Erdogan.
Avi Melamed: Turkey has been creating an expansion influence across the Middle East.
Avi Melamed: The the difference, I would say, in in comparison to Iran, is that you? You could see you mentioned accurately
Avi Melamed: what was not up not long time ago. What was the the land Bridge that actually physically created an Iranian influence corridor stretching from Iran through Iraq, through Syria, through Lebanon, all the way to the eastern basin of the Mediterranean. We don't see something similar in the Turkish model. You you won't find a Turkish corridor of extension that is, is continuing, stretching from Turkey.
Avi Melamed: but you will find a remote fingers, sort of speaking or arms of the Turkish rule, but Erdogan, so you find the presence in the eastern basin of the Mediterranean in Cyprus, for example, in the northern part of Cyprus, and you find their military presence in Qatar.
Avi Melamed: you find their military presence in Somalia. You find them massively involved in the war in Libya.
Avi Melamed: trying to extend influence in Sudan. So you will find in Yemen as well. So you will find those extension. But it's different in this from the story of the mullah regime, because you don't find this land continuity.
Avi Melamed: as the mullah regime was able to create at least up until recently, what you called described as the land corridor stretching from Iran all the way to the Mediterranean.
Avi Melamed: In one of our session, as you probably show, so we are going to have a session talking about Turkey. We'll have, of course, a guest educator, and it will be very interesting to see how the history and the contemporary chronology of Turkey intertwined in the context of Erdogan.
Avi Melamed: a hegemonic vision and ambition in in the in the region.
Avi Melamed: Yeah. So anyway, thank you all, we've made it by 3, 1 min late. Thank you all for your patience, and we hope that you found this meaningful. Please. If you have any feedback again. We want this to be for you.
Avi Melamed: A lot of you jumped ahead to future sessions. In the questions. So I think that's amazing. We'll definitely get to a lot of what you asked about some in the next session when it's oh, they can't hear me. You can hear me. But.
Maia Hoffman: I can talk.
Avi Melamed: Right. Never mind. See, I'm going through Avi's computer anyway, not mine. So anyway. So Nationalism. Next week our guest will be Abdulaziz Al-hamis.
Avi Melamed: Who's an amazing fascinating expert. We will have his information. He's Saudi. We will have his information on the portal over the next few days his bio he will bring his resources to the session that we'll have on the portal afterwards.
Avi Melamed: I'm sure I'll be in touch with you all because I'm neurotic by Whatsapp and email. But you can always find we'll send you the portal after you can always find the link to the zoom on the portal. As Didier said, the recording of this session will be on the portal. The Powerpoint will be on the portal, and some other extra
Avi Melamed: things that Diddy and I were talking about as the session progressed, that we can offer you I will send out also a list of your names, email addresses. I will create the Whatsapp group. I wanted to wait till after this group. I'll create a Whatsapp group.
Avi Melamed: I will send out an email that has your school, your phone number and your email on it. And your name? Obviously, and yeah, we'll be in touch regarding next session. If you can log in 10 min early. We can do a quick
Avi Melamed: round of another group getting to know each other. That would be wonderful. And you know I'll be in touch with you all by email and Whatsapp, with questions and notices. And please feel free to reach out to me anytime for anything. And we really thank you for your patience. We know today was long, and we really thank you. We're grateful for your participation, and very thankful for your patience.
Avi Melamed: Yes, and I will add, as a concluding note of this session today. I hope that it helps you to understand one of the biggest, I would say feature of the Middle East in the Middle East. History is present.
Avi Melamed: All right. See you next time. Thank you all. Thank you. Thank you. Bye-bye, bye.